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Today is the day of questions, got another one for your consideration please.
How about ground guide hand signals, is there a British training manual for that? There's a great but very short shot of Polish Shermans embarking for Normandy. In this two second clip an MP from the traffic control squadron is using a specific clenched fist to indicate which track to lock up while motioning with his other hand as the tank turns. This may sound like a nitpicking type question but if I'm going to be in view of the public while moving armour, I might as well use the proper hand signals if possible. In addition, it would give every member of the team a standardized means of communicating with the driver. I'm sure there was a lot of common sense type signals used as well but I'd rather have something documented if possible. From my personal experience in the Navy, I noticed the Army and Air Force folks seemed to definitely have codified hand signals when moving vehicles. I had "organizational envy" because us Navy guys just flailed our hands wildly and screamed "Mom-back." Of course that was just my experience. I'm sure there was probably some official training provided by the Navy, I was most likely sick that day. http://www.mapleleafup.net/forums/im...ies/cheers.gif Thanks, Chris |
#2
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I have a copy of the official British Army manual for vehicle signals, it's dated 1980's but likely unchanged for years. My experience has been that tank crews use a version of it in reality..... However, the basic principles should be simple and unambiguous. The hardest thing is to get the driver, who is usually the owner, to do as he is directed. Most tank owners tend to think they know best and don't take direction well!
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Adrian Barrell |
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We have a very set pattern in the Cdn military. It always perturbs me when a guy suddenly introduces hand signals from whatever civilian trucking company that he worked for before entering the CF.
The other big problem I run into is kind of the opposite of what tankbarrel comments on. When I am moving armour, I very often get guides who overthink the backwards movement and give me the opposite signal to what I need. When backing up next to another piece of armour, it can be embarrassing. When backing onto a semitrailer with only an inch or two to spare on both sides, this can be disastrous. I will either freeze the vehicle and ask the guide if that's what he really wants, or else make a very slight correction in the direction he asks for, to which he will usually realize his mistake and make the proper hand signal. Even with a guide, sometimes things still go wrong. I was backing a M113A2 off a semi trailer about two weeks ago. The ramps were quite steep, and it was the first time I was using this trailer with the 113. When the carrier got to it's tipping point, I must have had one tiller bar dragging a little tighter than the other and the carrier decided to turn about 20° from straight. I tried to make corrections in that split second and it was not working out, so I braced for what I thought was going to be a nasty ride down to earth. It came down as smooth as butter....I guess with the distance of carrier that hung over before the tip, it was close enough to the ground that all worked out. On the return trip, once I was at the tipping point, I just let the carrier roll off until I was off the trailer. |
#4
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Go ahead back up
or right turn left.... Are there a set of hand signals that we could all learned based on the military usage...... I have encountered the same problem when backing up my trailer and getting help.....and then I look in the rear view mirror and get the signals all reversed again.....??? This is a very important topic.... Cheers
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Bob Carriere....B.T.B C15a Cab 11 Hammond, Ontario Canada Last edited by Bob Carriere; 29-08-16 at 17:28. |
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owner, to do as he is directed. Most tank owners tend to think they know best and don't take direction well!
__________________ Speak for yourself Adrian. I rely entirely on the commander be it ground or mounted. I just pick my commanders very very carefully indeed. I have seen A carrier owner get lambasted by arena staff for not watching or doing as instructed by ground commander. And have myself had cause to somewhat "Firm" with drivers when I have undertaken commander role. You are right though (some) owners don't listen, but my experience is those are a minority, of which I tend to steer clear of. Hand signals wise, I was taught the following Commander initiates direction of travel. Until notified otherwise that will be the direction of travel. The commander will raise his / her arm fist clenched, which ever hand is raised with clenched fist, that track must be locked to allow steering input., the hand will promptly be lowered which means the brake on that track must be removed and allowed to roll. Arms across the front of the commander in a cross signify to stop immediately. I usually use signals indicating a bend rather than a nip / brake and some others which are familiar with my group, not official of course. All good fun ! Oh and ground commanders ALWAYS command from the front of the vehicle NOT the rear !
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is mos redintegro __5th Div___46th Div__ 1942 Ford Universal Carrier No.3 MkI* Lower Hull No. 10131 War Department CT54508 (SOLD) 1944 Ford Universal Carrier MkII* (under restoration). 1944 Morris C8 radio body (under restoration). Last edited by RichardT10829; 29-08-16 at 17:28. |
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Very true guys , we had a carrier owner on our pitch who would not listen to directions and nearly took the tent down . The serving ASM who was seeing him back was quite direct in telling him what he thought of him . Then the same guy was being seen off a lowloader and decided to do his own thing and just about went off the side of the lorry . Needless to say most of my transport guys and crews avoid him like the plague - very dangerous to think you can see more than someone commanding a Vehicke from out side the vehicle . Be careful folks .
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Shaun Hindle Morris C8 Ford GPW jeep 1945 Morris 1000 (ex mil) SAS LSV Harley Davidson MT 350 motor cycle Universal carrier MK 1*1943 Ronson (under restoration) Universal carrier MK 2* 1944 (Puddle Jumper HSK 345) Ferret MK 1/1 1956 Ferret MK 2/4 1958 CVR(T) Scorpion 432 MK2 Daimler MK1 armoured car 1943 (winner best wheeled armour W&P show 2011) Daimler Dingo MK2 1944 (awaiting restoration, aquired 11/12/2011) Fordson WOT 3 D 1940 (awaiting restoration ) |
#7
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I was, and in 30 years of driving and directing tanks, I've seen a few potential disasters......
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Adrian Barrell |
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