CWM visit

chris vickery · #1 16-04-12, 16:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ed Storey

Chris, I certainly agree with your point that even when in a museum you have to be cautious of the accuracy of the material. I know that there is the common perception that what is presented in a museum is 100% accurate but unfortunately this is not the case as errors do crop up. The challenge is getting these errrors corrected.

Ed, you have summed up exactly my point, maybe a little more eloquently than myself.

Robin, no offense taken, of course, I appreciate a good debate.

Mike Cecil · #2 16-04-12, 16:54

Hi 'Little Jo'

Yes, the $21M for the WW1 displays will go a long way. The project has been underway for two years, with considerable planning already achieved. I think the $$ are to cover not only the displays, but some of the commemorations as well: the period 2014 to 2018 is going to be a busy one for the Australain War Memorial (so what's new? The soon to retire Director always had something happening) as the various centennials roll around.

The AWM has a reasonable WW1 vehicle collection, both horse drawn and mechanized, that has already seen many $$ spent on it.

As for the CWM, I seem to remember Jim W telling me that the lower floor of the new building was really a 'display-storage' area, with little work or presentation of the exhibits. So I gather they are presented 'warts and all', so to speak.

One of the most memorable exhibits I remember was a StugIII, blown to hell and unrestored (but conserved, no doubt). Excellent exhibit!

Mike C

chris vickery · #3 16-04-12, 18:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mike Cecil

As for the CWM, I seem to remember Jim W telling me that the lower floor of the new building was really a 'display-storage' area, with little work or presentation of the exhibits. So I gather they are presented 'warts and all', so to speak.
Mike C

Mike, that pretty much sums up what I am talking about....

Bob Carriere · #4 17-04-12, 03:07

The CWM is not on the priority list for government spending.....a lot of us would not have the patience to put up with the frustration that Jason has to endure. He and others in the Museum are doing the best they can with the little they have.

I don't always agree with what or how things have been displayed....and I have strong feeling about what they did to the Churchill.... but having said that.... how many of you remember the glorious days of the small Annex on Sussex drive..... for decades that is all Canada had to show about our valiant contribution to the war..... hulks of tanks were set on fire by kids who crawled in the inside...... the miniature japanese submarine that used to be stored in old stone structures (circa 1955)off Wellingtons street and where St Redempteur streets used to cross...... the roof collapsed and the upper hull dinged by the heavy roofing beams......that was the neighbourhood I grew up in

What we have is a tremendous improvement...... perfect no....but at least they are saving some equipment. To us self appointed experts there is always something that is not correct...... the color shade is wrong or the wrong period taillights were installed...... to 90% of the visitors it is awsome.
Who amongst us can swear to the accuray of what is displayed about the Great War... over the years details get lost in the shuffle of time..... what they depict is still a gruesome representation of what war was like.....

To today's generation of rice burners a big flat nosed CMP is just a brute. We are a dying breed that can actually talk about repairing them and still enjoy the primitive driving conditions

I drove my rolling chassis this weekend.....first time since New Years weekend snow outing....... it was invigorating !!!!!!

Bob

Little Jo · #5 17-04-12, 03:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mike Cecil

Hi 'Little Jo'

Yes, the $21M for the WW1 displays will go a long way. The project has been underway for two years, with considerable planning already achieved. I think the $$ are to cover not only the displays, but some of the commemorations as well: the period 2014 to 2018 is going to be a busy one for the Australain War Memorial (so what's new? The soon to retire Director always had something happening) as the various centennials roll around.

The AWM has a reasonable WW1 vehicle collection, both horse drawn and mechanized, that has already seen many $$ spent on it.

As for the CWM, I seem to remember Jim W telling me that the lower floor of the new building was really a 'display-storage' area, with little work or presentation of the exhibits. So I gather they are presented 'warts and all', so to speak.

One of the most memorable exhibits I remember was a StugIII, blown to hell and unrestored (but conserved, no doubt). Excellent exhibit!

Mike C

Hi Mike

You are right. It has been years since I last visited the CWA, the last time was for the Internment of the Unknown Soldier. I must make an effort to re visit again. The CWA has always been a fabulous place to visit and well worth the long drive from Adelaide. I must confess I made a mistake when I quoted the figure of $21 Million it was actually $27 Million, good injection of funds.

Cheers

Tony

Dennis Gelean (RIP) · #6 17-04-12, 05:13

The old Vimy House where big stuff was stored/displayed had Veterans as docents, one fine gentleman Was Capt. James Bond ret. (the real one).Gas warfare expert
the other old building had a a German air raid siren as named by the donor. My identical one is marked inside made by British boat works. who knows maybe they bought some from Britain? Think we have problems, the Canterbury NZ Museum closed due to Earthquake risk www.stuff.nz
How many beautiful collections are dismantled because we get old,sick or die
that is why we need young people introduced into our hobby

Ed Storey · #7 17-04-12, 11:57

Bob, I agree that 90% of the people who visit a museum do not recognize any errors and for the most part enjoy their visit. But what you have forgotten is that there is a difference between museums and private collections. A private collector can do whatever they want with their stuff, if the lights are not correct or the colour shade is off the only person they have to satisfy is themselves.

Museums are different, there is perception that what is presented in a museum and what is on display in a museum is 100% correct, much like a text book. We all know that this is unachievable as we are all human and make errors, but this 100% is what a museum should strive for. To sit back and say that well 90% of the people who visit will not know the difference so therefore why worry is wrong. That attitude can apply to an amusement park but not an institution that is preserving national history.

To say that "Who amongst us can swear to the accuray of what is displayed about the Great War... over the years details get lost in the shuffle of time....." is a cop out. Yes, the details may well be lost, but that premise should not be used as an excuse not to research and search out the answers.

Stiving for improvement is the key, not sitting back and finding excuses to stick with the statis quo.

Bruce MacMillan · #8 18-04-12, 21:23

One factor that often gets ignored is the history of an item. Perhaps a vehicle had a "field modification" by a few men in a unit in 1945. Decades later someone says that wasn't the way they came from the factory and removes the mod effectively removing some of its provenance.

There are many instances of "never say never" so care should be taken when restoring an item.

I feel museums should conserve and educate. Keep an item in the original state and discover as much about it's history as possible. If a vehicle came right from the factory then, great, keep it that way. If it has bullet holes and Normandy sand then it's story should be told.

Ed Storey · #9 19-04-12, 04:15

Unfortunately, it seems that many museums treat vehicles like a doormat. Park it outside, let the kids climb on it, the birds nest in it, the weather deteriorate it and then slap on a new coat of paint to hold it all together. Fortunately this trend is starting to change in Canada, but at an agonizingly slow pace.

There also seems to be a hierarchy of artefacts with military vehicles being at the low end of the scale. Since military vehicles are big, dirty and heavy, the tendency is to park them outside and not really pay much attention to their preservation and provenance. The consequences of this are the loss of our automotive history and the vehicles that represented it.

If this trend is to be slowed down or stopped, now is the time to do it. There has been a thread on this forum discussing how the M113 series of vehicles is being disposed of and sold for scrap. The CF used over 1000 of these vehicles, and only a fraction of them are being upgraded for future use. With only a small percentage being saved by museums this means that in the very near future any Canadian used example of this vehicle type will be a rare commodity. It is a given that collectors will no longer be allowed to privately own many types of military vehicles but were the enthusiast/collector can still make a big difference is to assist/support/pressure those museums that do display vehicles to take a scholarly and planned approach to acquiring and preserving this equipment.

The chance to save the Cold War era Canadian M Series equipment may have passed, but that does not mean that all is lost. Some of the latest Afghanistan equipment may be released and this would be the time to not only save this material, but to make sure what is preserved is not parked outside to become the latest doormat.