complete Bofors Gun Engine

malcolm erik bogaert · #1 31-08-10, 13:43

spoke to a retired farmer yesterday at the Glendale Show( not OZ but UK) he has a complete Bofors Gun Engine if anybodys requires same..best regards malcolm

Ivor Ramsden · #2 31-08-10, 23:02

Do you mean a self-propelled Bofors gun engine, a Morris 4-cylinder one?

malcolm erik bogaert · #3 01-09-10, 20:34

Ivor I have no idea...he said no generator but complerte engine for Bofors Gun...but I can always ask! cheers malcolm

Ivor Ramsden · #4 02-09-10, 21:23

Please ask! I'm puzzled as to what it is. Normal Bofors guns weren't powered but there was the Morris C9/B which was basically a Bofors gun stuck on top of a Morris Quad chassis. If it's the engine from one of these I would be interested. If it's from one of these, could you ask if he's got any other bits?

This is our museum's C9/B

Neil Ashley · #5 03-09-10, 09:24

He will be talking about the generator used for Bofors with power mounts.

I have the Douglas version but they were also made by Coventry Climax amongst others.

They produce a strange three phase voltage of no use for any thing else. Most of the UK survivors seem to have been rebuilt post-war to 240 voltage.

If it is one of these I may be interested.

I thought the Morris SP version used a pto driven generator.

malcolm erik bogaert · #6 03-09-10, 10:02

I rather think its probably the latter..as he did say generator wasnt there...however I will call into the local garage and get his telephone number...wil also try and get a picture or two...best regards malcolm

Neil Ashley · #7 03-09-10, 10:06

I doubt if there is a surviving Bofors left designed to use this generator.

There were two of the Coventry Climax versions on e-bay recently.

Ivor Ramsden · #8 03-09-10, 22:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by Neil Ashley

I thought the Morris SP version used a pto driven generator.

Yes, it did. Our truck still has the PTO and holes for various fixings & cables. Our Gunners tell me that they preferred manual operation to Predictor operation. This seems to have generally been the case with the SP Bofors - I haven't come across any records of them being used in action with the Predictor gear and all the photos that I've seen show manually operated weapons.

malcolm erik bogaert · #9 05-09-10, 20:33

well I met the gentleman again today and the engine at the local Honey Farm Show...its an old one alright..plate states made by Jowett for Scott...to me it looked like a Douglas or an Armstrong Siddley...however he's keeping it for the moment as there seemed to be lot of interest from other MV types.!sorry didnt have the camera at the time...best regards malcolm

Richard Farrant · #10 05-09-10, 20:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by malcolm erik bogaert

...its an old one alright..plate states made by Jowett for Scott...to me it looked like a Douglas or an Armstrong Siddley...

Hi Malc,

That rings a bell..I recollect sorting through some old manuals in the Tech Library when I worked in REME workshops, and came across a wartime manual on a power unit made by Jowett, think it was a flat twin engine, possibly similar to the Bradford van....maybe

. No reference as to what it was used for if I remember.

The name Scott is always associated with water cooled two strokes, as a point of interest.

Neil Ashley · #11 06-09-10, 08:48

Without the generator which you will never find its only fit for a stationary engine enthusiast.

This is the Douglas version of which I have one in pieces.

malcolm erik bogaert · #12 06-09-10, 12:45

yes it looks like a Douglas...and yes he is indeed a stationery engine man...cheers malcolm PS saw a generator from one on an old inventors farm..he had 2 home made generators one with the Armstrong Siddley engine and the other one had a generator from a Landing craft which he said was Canadian! he was quite a character..came from the Aristocrcy..the locals called him the Black Prince...name of Houston and he invented the mordern potato picking machine!best regards malcolm

Phil Waterman · #13 06-09-10, 17:35

Hi Malcolm

I've been reading this thread with interest waiting to read the solution to the mystery. I was wondering all along if the solution was going to be the generator set for the battery fire control system to drive the director or was it going to be a SP (self propelled) unit meant for moving the gun units short distance to relay the firing position.

What I have always wondered was the director unit telling the gun crew where to fire (in short an electro mechanical fire control computer) or was the director actually controlling power traverse and elevation electric motors on the gun itself?

The US version of this generator set M-5 is relatively common and they are a very nice little unit. Very quiet running as they tick over at 1000 rpm if running 50 cycles or 1200 rpm running 60cycles. The US M-5 was built as a 3 phase 125 volt unit 60 cycle unit and as a 3 phase 130 volt 50 cycle unit, specifically designed to power 40mm Bofers. (see manual http://www.canadianmilitarypattern.com/Generator.htm )

What I always found interesting about the M-5 unit was the effort they put into it for dual taps in the control panel for the 50 or 60 Cycle at different voltages (see page 73 of manual). From what I have read on these units the reason for this was so that the gen sets would work with the British Bofers units.

Now as to the comment about use of 40 MM as battery fired central fire control units. The only references I have ever seen to specific combat use was on the English Coast against V-1s but this reference is a little soft as it was speaking primarily about 90 MM units controlled by SCR-584 Radar Units.

Has anybody come across more information on the 40MM fire control systems?

PS- The M-5 unit makes a nice gen-set to provide power for camping use at shows for my C60S Radio Truck.

Phil Waterman · #14 06-09-10, 17:57

After posting my question about fire control and power traverse of 40mm I found a major source of information in an unlikely web site. The Historic Naval Ships Association, http://www.hnsa.org/index.htm but in specific http://www.hnsa.org/doc/boforstm252/index.htm which is the US Technical Manual for the 40MM (complete) which also touches on the Canadian and British units and some of their differences.

Yes, some versions had both manual and powered traverse and elevation control driven from a central fire control.

Now I'll go read the manual.

malcolm erik bogaert · #15 06-09-10, 21:00

thanks Phill you are a mine of information...next question...I have somebody who is looking for a complete Bofors Gun...Ive already sold him the wheeled version but he also needs a bolt on to the deck version...any thoughts! best regards malcolm

Phil Waterman · #16 06-09-10, 22:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by malcolm erik bogaert

thanks Phill you are a mine of information...next question...I have somebody who is looking for a complete Bofors Gun...Ive already sold him the wheeled version but he also needs a bolt on to the deck version...any thoughts! best regards malcolm

Hi Malcolm

Well I can blame you for spending the day in front of the computer instead of working on the trucks, but I've been having fun following the thread of information about 40 MM Bofors and the different Fire Control Directors and Radar units. The Navy site is rather interesting once you find their search engine http://www.hnsa.org/search/index.htm which lead into the back door of the US Library of Congress technical research papers search engine which I don't seem to be able to get to through the normal library site (even my wife who is a reference librarian can't fiqure out how I got in.)

US Bofors and control equipment can be found at http://www.antiaircraft.org/index.htm.

As to a source on Bofors can't be of any help have not seen even bits of these in the states for years. Given the rules on this type of weapon even demilled they are likely to be scarce.

Cheers Phil