Restoration Rant

[Richard Coutts-Smith]

Am I the only person in the world who does not stick everything together with bloody sealastic?? Out in the shed tonight scraping away at someones quick fix shortcut yet again, and realised that every vehicle I've had for the last 20 or so years has had the stuff bubbling and oozing out of hubs, diffs, transfer cases and the rest.
Realised after all this time that it generally does not bode well for what you find inside, but have decided not to mention the missing axle spacer and bearing back plate in (not) the wheel hub tonight.
Always found it quite relaxing, cutting and punching gaskets, but I am obviously on my Pat Malone.
Rant Ends
Rich

[Phil Waterman]

Richard

Your "rant" about sealastic or silicon and about how it is miss used is well taken.

The first thing I've noticed is that people use way to much resulting in it squeezing out in places you really do not want it squeezing out. I've taken apart hydraulic systems where the stuff had been picked up in the flow of oil and smeared all over the pump surfaces followed by the failure of the pump.

Yes there are some people myself included that still cut gaskets and even take note of how thick they should be, particularly on anything that has shims to preload bearings. I use a scanner and computer to copy gaskets and then print them on gasket material then cut them out.

The failure to wait 24 hours after using any of these “sealants” before filling with oil, water what ever and then running is of course probably the worst problem.


Cheers Phil

[Harry Moon]

another problem that comes up when you smear the stuff and get it into a blind hole, the wrench got a little squishy before getting tight and then BANG i blew the ear of the waterpump mounting, (on my HEMI no less) I had hydrauliced the casting and the pressure found it's own way out . I've got smarter since then .

[hrpearce]

Yes Richard I use sealastic on gaskets because I usually cut the gasket out of the side of a cerial box so a thin smear helps the seal. Where shims are used and thickess is critical I use loctite No. 3 autmotive non-hardening sealant. As for it bubbling out of joins I'm too cheap to use that much

[Howard]

Silicone sealant, gaffa tape & zip ties. Three of the most critical 'tools' in my shed. But you are right, too many people use too much of the stuff. And in my daily work I often see DIY mechanics (like myself) stuff electronic sensors such as air flow sensors & oxygen sensors by using the incorrect type of sealant too!
(Not that this is a problem on CMP's!)

[cantankrs]

Hi Phil,

Sorry to hijack Richard's (important) rant for a moment - and silastic partially blocked engine oil passages can end up disastrous, but..

I've seen this business mentioned in another post I think. Interesting idea and I will certainly consider borrowing it . Washing the c**p off my hands before I touch the computer will slow down the process...
On the other hand getting the gasket cut right the first time is an advantage..
Just need to find some gasket paper that doesn't curl so stiffly you have to soak it in a bucket for a minute before you can get it flat!



Alex
--
M3 Grant, Val, Ferrets, WM20, CMP's

[gordon]

I recommend to the House black semi-structural panel sealant, the sort of stuff they use to seal panel joints during repairs. Bodyline is the most common UK brand from Brown Brothers or wherever.


My Dodges originally used rubber strip to seal round the windscreen glass, side door glass, and rear window glass. Each of those locations are rot-traps because the rubber tends to admit and trap the water exactly where you don't want it.

Dodge windscreens tend to rot along the bottom edge INSIDE where the condensation has run down and collected. You have to cut this rot out and MIG it up, which leave a solid but imperfect channel to re-mount the glass.

Military side window frames with the full metal frames all round can be OK, but the versions used on the militarised civilian trucks (WC3x and WC4x half ton 4 x 2, for example) just used a single bottom runner which when new has a spring effect channel to clamp the glass in its rubber strip. Many of the ones I've seen (OK - all of them) have still been structurally solid, but with no spring left in the U channel area - forcing glass + strip into it just pushes the side of the channel apart.


The structural sealer covers both jobs, and many others. I can mount the windscreen glass in that sealer all the way round and it give a solid clean appearance that absolutely seals, and just filling the bottom channel of the side window frame and pushing the glass into it before it sets gives a solid watertight joint that will never move in ordinary use.

In both those applications, and many others, when it is set, it is rigid, but not so hard that you can't cut it out, shape it, or ease the glass out to refit it if you got the location wrong, plus it also works to glue rubber seals like windscreen outer seals to the appropriate areas, and mount panels.

I'll have to admit I've never used it as a gasket substitute though.

[Richard Coutts-Smith]

Phil,
Nice to see another dinosaur out there. Neat idea with scanner, if I ever get that far advanced electronically I will be giving that one a shot.
Gordon,
you have described the only correct use for the stuff (is that the sound of guns being loaded), as with a lot of products they are excellent for what they are designed for, and sealing glass like that would be it. The problem is that it is not a cure all for everything that leaks, saw it used on a fuel line (Petrol) once, they do not mix at all well.
If a quick fix is a must, there are several reputable brands of liquid gasket products that are at least designed for this enviroment.

Just don't ask me about my other pet hate, Adjustable Spanners (Shifter's over here) otherwise we'll be here all night....
Chip removed from shoulder
Rich

[Mike K]

I use permatex No. 3 ...you get quite fast at hole punching after a while . I once saw a VW beetle with silastic repair in the fuel tank.. the owner had stripped down the caby 3-4 times , but small bits of the stuff kept on clogging the carby up.

The neighbour here uses liquid nails, the builders adhesive , for many applications..he restores X series Falcons from XK to XF . He's a bush mechanic, but very clever too.

BTW does anyone know where to buy sheets of the special diaphram rubber used in carburettors ... Like Phil, I print out the shape and use it as a template . They ask silly prices ( $20 ) for a 5 cent bit of rubber , and I'd like to make my own. eg, the Land Rover Solex carby has 2 of them

Mike

[hrpearce]

Why print, cut and punch gaskets when all you have to do is place a piece of gasket paper oer the part tap around the edges with a small ball pein hammr and tap the holes with the ball end. I've cut gskets as small as the bowl on a zeneth up draft carby on a Jap motor sucksfully this way.

[cletrac (RIP)]

I've tried numerous gasket silicones and one brand The Right Stuff is way better than any others I've used. It's black and expensive and comes in a caulking type tube. You have to be careful with how much you use but oil leaks just don't happen.
I've taken engines apart where somebody went overboard with RV sealant and the oil pump pickup was half plugged with the stuff.

[Tony Smith]

Originally Posted by Richard Coutts-Smith

Gordon,
you have described the only correct use for the stuff..
Rich

Rich, as a Champ and Humber enthusiast, you will be familiar with Rolls-Royce's use of Hylomar, RR's catchphrase being that their engines were so finely made that most gaskets were redundant (note that Hylomar's proper use is the coating of gaskets, not the replacement of them).

As Alex has mentioned, trying to find good quality gasket material is difficult. Although living in a mining and industrial area well blessed with industrial and bearing suppliers, asking for gasket paper is met with a blank look and a sweep of the hand towards the Loctite or Permatex stand in the shop. Shops that do carry it tend to be Super Cheap Auto, and the stuff is so tightly rolled it seems to be made from Shirley Temple's hair clippings.

[Keith Webb]

There are some old-timers at our local AutoPro shop who are very helpful. I asked one of them about gasket paper after a bit of reminiscing, chin scratching went past all the shelves of cheap junk made in China and produced a tightly curled (as Tony said) piece of thick gasket paper I've yet to find a use for. It would certainly not fit through a printer! At least those older guys knew what you were talking about.

Was Hylomar like the stuff we still have here made from some sort of resin like pine sap? Euan has a story about his father having it drip into his hair as he worked on the Jeep many years ago. The only solution was a close shave. That stuff sticks like sh1t to a blanket.

Bring back W.L. Ryan and restore Elizabeth St Melbourne to the way it was in the 1970s! In those days you not only had Ryans, but Repco (when it used to be reasonably good) Vanguards, run by a couple of ancient eccentrics, and even the Ring Gear Company which you could watch through the door as they oil hardened the gears. There's my rant. Plenty more to come in the future!

[Phil Waterman]

Trying to buy sheet gasket material at auto parts store here in the States is an exercise in futility, what they have is often ruined before you get it having been rolled so tightly that it is creased. Try and industrial gasket and seal house you may have better luck.

But as a substitute try a print shop, I took a couple of samples of the thicknesses I needed to a custom printing shop and ask the guy if he had any high rag content paper in those thickness. He came back with a carton about 24x36 with all sorts of different high grade printing paper. Asked him what he wanted and he said its all left over he was going to end up throwing away and gave it to me. I accepted with many thanks.

I've used it to make gaskets for the axle covers on the 3 tons, transfer cases. I cut the gaskets out then spray the with the red Pemitex Spray Gasket Cement. Only problem I've had is you can not use the Permitex Spray on fuel system gaskets, the ethanol in the gas now dissolves the Permitex you can see the red steaks running down the side of the carb.

Cheers Phil

[Mike Timoshyk]

Just a quick note from my Stoker days in the navy, we used Red Lead paint as a sealant especially on face to face items such as turbine casings and of course in a pinch good 'ol "Dog Shit"...which I might add can be used under the most unusual circumstances. Most commonly used to adhear thermometers to pillar blocks and bearing housings.

cheers

Mike Timoshyk