70s-80s 3 Color Camouflage Discussion

[Scott Bentley]

Originally Posted by rob love

I have been using an original can of the IRR flat green made by pittsburg paint around 1990. The color is basically the same as your bottom photos. The IRR did tend to fade pretty good. The black would turn to grey, and the two greens would almost turn to the same color. The Iltis used a different form of paint if I recall, and weathered the elements quite well, whereas I always found the IRR to be very porous. It did not seem to provide a good seal against the elements.

Whats your opinion/thoughts on the top color Rob? Do you think it was originally the same but just faded out to its current form?

[rob love]

Originally Posted by armybuck041

Whats your opinion/thoughts on the top color Rob? Do you think it was originally the same but just faded out to its current form?

Yep. Even the best of hardened glossy paints will fade after almost 30 years, especially when stored outdoors, washed with steam cleaners and made parade ready with engine oils.

I have the original paint color chips book for the CGSB colors at home. It dates way way back. I don't think there was ever a change in the individual color specs on these, but there would have been variation in how they were painted, what reducers were used, and if any hardeners were added. Also, how the paint was stored, how many times it was frozen, and how old it was. Most MLVWs got partial or complete paint jobs during the early 90s refurb program. It was all IRR paint at that point, and the work was done at various civilian contractors.

[Eric B]

Hello Folks

My M151A2 was three tone Camo.
The two greens did fade to look almost exactly the same colour.

If you look on the rear of the roll cage you will see where it faded around the back window and the sides where it was exposed to the sun.

I have original cans of the two greens and the paint ship book as well, and they are both darker than the Pea Green.

I do have a can of Pea green, which i bought a number of years ago. It is a much lighter green but i cannot find an exact reference to it in the paint chip book nor do i have the CDN DND number. This did match a light green which was hand painted on my M151A2 windshield defroster shields. This sample came from a CDN Govt list and was marked camouflage green. For those who have the Govt paint book it looks close to the 103-114 series but a little darker, or 503-322 but a little lighter. This looks close to the faded darker green.

Thanks

Eric

[Scott Bentley]

Eric,

Since Pea Green is not an official color, can you please verify what color (503-321, 503-319 or Flat Olive Drab, Field Green etc etc) it is you are referring to as "Pea Green".

Better yet, why not post up a pic of the Can Label?

Honestly, the term Pea Green has caused me a ton of confusion and I'm guilty of using the term myself.

The Defrost Shields are missing in your pic....

[Matthew Reid]

It is always fun to disscuss paint lol.

Here is my take on it.


On the NOS Iltis body tub the 503-321 was the base coat. The darkest Green on the picture posted. I would call this is an Olive Green but not the same colour as the old Olive Drab used in WWII.


The Lighter Green (Pea Green as it has been called) on the Iltis is 503- 322.
No question about that as I matched it to the one Iltis that I have that still has the orginal paint on it.
I wet sanded a portion of this lighter green to remove the oxidized-faded paint and it is an exact match for the 503-322 colour chip.
503-322 has a tendancy to fade to a bluer green.

The darker green (olive) on the MLVW, M38A1's the Cougar and the M151 would be the 503-321 The lighter on the MLVW M38A1's and M151 green would be badly faded 503-319.
On the Cougar the lighter green is 503-319 but not faded.

503-319 is a near exact match for FS34094
FS34094 is the current 383 CARC colour. And we know how much it fades and lightens up. It fades up to the light Feild Green 503-322 and lighter. We have numerous examples of this happening.

Here are colour comparisions to the 2 best FS matches of the 503-319 colour chip.
Pictures were taken outside in natural light on an overcast day.






I suspect that 503-222 or something close was used to match faded 503-319 or faded 383 Carc when touch up's or partial repaints were nessesary.

For some more referance.

http://www.mapleleafup.net/forums/sh...710#post129710


Hope this helps



Matthew

[Scott Bentley]

Thanks Matt,

Here is a pic of my two original cans:

[spinnerhawken]

Hey guys,

I will chime in here as I feel partly responsible for restarting this 319/321 paint discussion. This is due primarily because for years, much like everyone else, I have been trying to find paint for my TOW MUTT. I thank Scotty for leading the charge here to once, and for all, hopefully find a workable solution for paint codes and possible suppliers.
For my project I think the best I can do is 34079 as my 319 and flat Tremclad black for my 2 -tone cam. I won't even touch the topic of 321 yet, as this has no doubt caused some hair pulling.
With respect to 322, I just wanted to confirm, are we saying that the 322 - almost sea foam colour - was also used as part of the cam pattern? Based on the colour charts provided at the links, it looks a lot like the inside of my M113 in Germany back in the early 90's.
Also, I know in the cam scheme paperwork that I have seen a number of times posted on this site everyone talks about the cam pattern. What is also attached to that diagram, but not posted that I have seen, are two typed pages that outline exactly what colour goes where. I don't see 322 listed as part of it. Does anyone know if it was substituted locally?
I will also include a scan of the Eric's Pea Green colour (hope you don't mind Eric). It may be slightly off as it is a scan and my painted sample is semi gloss, but I think it's pretty accurate. Has anyone else seen this colour floating around on any vehicles or colour charts? If so, what is the code for it?
Anyway, I have also included a scan of a late 80's M38A1. Not for any real reason other than I found it recently and thought you guys might like it.

[Scott Bentley]

Originally Posted by Stuart Fedak

OK, what is the paint colour of the mount that the MT-1029 tray is attached to? It looks like Canadian Tire Krylon OD green (that is not faded)?

I painted one of my Iltis with the Krylon OD green. It takes a few years to fade, and is easy to touch up......... works well on metal and vinyl seats/doors and tarps.

Cheers!
Stuart

Yup, Krylon OD on the Support Bracket