CMD Numbers!

David_Hayward (RIP) · #1 23-11-06, 12:05

As we all know the original CANADIAN MECHANIZATION DEPOT was based in the General Motors Limited works in West Bay Road, New Docks, Southampton, after most of the plant was leased to the Canadian Government in February 1940. The CMD was run by a civilian team, all it seems, ex-Ford of Canada, and based at Canadian Mechanization HQ in 2,3 & 4 Cockspur Street, the former Sun Life of Canada Assurance building right behind the Canadian High Commission which itself faced on to Trafalgar Square in central London. My garndfather worked in the Admiralty just a stone's throw away in Horse Guard's Parade. The attached photo is from 1940.

David_Hayward (RIP) · #2 23-11-06, 12:43

It appears that the CMHQ also had a small outstation or office in the Ford works at Dagenham, where a number of Canadian Fords were assembled as well as diverted French orders, from Canada and the US. In addition, from around the 1st December 1940, the new Canadian Mechanization Depot which was based in several bays of the Citroen Cars Limited works on the Slough Trading Estate in Slough, Buckinghamshire, completed the first batch of overload assembly of Canadian Fords. As we all know, the Southampton Plant was blitzed by the Luftwaffe, evening of Friday 30th November/morning of 1st December 1940. As a consequence of the blitzing, official photos were taken of the ruins on Sunday morning the 2nd. Two 1940 Model Chevrolet 4-door sedans clearly had numbers on the sides, and one was evidently "C.M.D. 3269" althought the "3" is not distinct. We know that 4,236 vehicles were assembled in Southampton, so logically the series started with, possibly a F15, number C.M.D. 1. However, it is not clear whether these numbers were applied on the line[s] as the vehicle came off, or when they were parked up inside or outside in the rear yard near the text track.

However we do know that the CMD in Slough allocated a new system, "CMD 15001" and up, so as not to cause confusion. Did Dagenham have their own allocation, perhaps starting with CMD 10001? Numbers CMD 15001 to 15005 seem to have been F-GT, F60H, F60H, C11AD and C11AD. This suggests that they were by then allocated as they were being delivered rather than allocated on the line unless they had at that time a mixed assembly line? The only photo I have that is not on this Forum that has a "C.M.D." number is a Diamond T G/S that looks as though it is about to be delivered with British order CMPs and Dodges.

Thanks to Clive (Law) we have a copy of ASSEMBLY PLANT INSTRUCTIONS A.P.I. No. 10 issued 22 May 1943. This states that on each assembled vehicle a "transit number" is to be stencilled on the front bumper and a conspicuous place on the right rear, preced by the letters "CMD". Vehicles handled by "your plant" and they were then named, had sequences allocated with # 30,001 resereved for Lep Transport Ltd in Chiswick, west London, [on the banks of the Thames] which took over the Canadian Chevrolet assembly work after Southampton was closed, plus the Goole warehouse where the Diamond T was assembled, with # 35,001 and up, and Tom Garner Ltd of Manchester[See Jeeps thread]#60,001 and up. However by then Citroen Cars in Slough was # 70,001 and up, which is at odds with the "CMD 15001" and up series. Austin Motors in Treforest had 112,001, and so no-one could have clashed with the 15,001 and up 1940 Slough series.

So, now we have it! Prior to the allocation of the Census Numbers by the RCAOC Census Branch, the vehicles were moved around under "transit numbers", and retrospectively I suggest that that is what the famous CMD numbers were

David_Hayward (RIP) · #3 23-11-06, 13:04

I knew nothing at all about this operation, and they only assembled a few Canadian vehicles, however they may have been involved in US vehicle assembly and Ministry of Supply rebuild work.

This is what I have found:

Quote:

I'm sorry that I haven't been able to find practically any information about the Austin Motors factory on the Treforest Trading Estate. Austin Morris Motor Co. took over the British Coated Board and Paper Mill Ltd factory on the Treforest Trading Estate in 1941 and set up an assembly line for war vehicles. One fifth of the factory was taken up with the storage of BCB equipment which was walled up at either end of the factory for recovery after the war. In 1946, the machines that were dismantled to allow Austin Motors to move in were pieced together again. The company became known as Wiggins Teape & Co and was one of the producers of the largest range of high-grade papers in the world. The building still stands today. The first attachment is a 1948 Ordnance Survey map of the trading estate

Hanno Spoelstra · #4 10-12-06, 22:40

David, here's a picture of CMD22171, an 11 cab Ford(?), experimentally fitted with a 40-mm Bofors gun. Enhancements to this design as described in the caption were made by Leyland Motors.

Hanno Spoelstra · #5 10-12-06, 22:54

And here is a pic of CMD(?)0461, I think CMD20461. Fitted with a wireless body by Leyland Motors at Kingston.

David_Hayward (RIP) · #6 11-12-06, 06:37

The Ford was probably ex-Citroen Cars Ltd, Slough CMD and the Chevrolet Lep Transport Ltd, Chiswick, London W.4. The Ford seems to have a "# 41S" open cab version of the 11, predating the F30B Bofors # 43S Cab. However it appears to be just a modified #11 Cab?

The CMD serials do not fit into the listing I have so I assume that they slotted in to the # CMD 15001 and up series started at Slough?

The DND papers suggest that Requisition # 28 was for "Bodies for Tractors L.A.A.", 100 off by Leyland Motors Ltd., one of which could have been converted by Leylands to a self-propelled version? Does that make sense?

The other is one from Requisition # 30 for 31 Bodies for Lorries 30-cwt Wireless from Leyland Motors Ltd. It they were produced by Leylands in Kingston, which one? Kingston-upon-Hull or Kingston-upon-Thames? Probably a Leyland truck depot.

The other Requisition from Leylands was # 31 for 15-cwt 2-wheeled 2kW Wireless Trailers and then in that timescale a Req. # 43 for a sole Body for Lorry 3-ton Air Support Control Office.

cliff · #7 11-12-06, 07:54

Quote:

Originally posted by Hanno Spoelstra
David, here's a picture of CMD22171, an 11 cab Ford(?), experimentally fitted with a 40-mm Bofors gun. Enhancements to this design as described in the caption were made by Leyland Motors.

Yes Hanno that is a Ford and I just love those two front mounted winches. This would make an unusual model.

Cheers
Cliff