11th Army Field Regt?

[John McGillivray]

Good day all,

I was wondering what type of guns the 11th Army Field Regt. RCA was using in Italy in the first part of 1944. I know that they were re-equipped with towed 25 pdrs in August 1944 when they became part of the 12th Bde group of 5CAD.

CMHQ Report 141 contains the following at the end of para 48:

“In Italy 5 Cdn Armd Div received 24 Sextons in April; on the formation of 12 Cdn Inf Bde they were replaced by tractor-drawn 25-prs (C.M.H.Q. file 13/Equip State/2/4: Equipment States, Cdn Forces in A.A.I.).”

5CAD never used Sextons in Italy. The only SP Fd Regt in the 5th Div was the 8th which used 105mm M7’s. They only changed over to Sextons after their move to NWE in the spring of 1945. Was it the 11th Army Field Regiment of 1 Cdn AGRA that was using the Sextons?

Also what would have been the number on the AoS of this Unit? When it served as the 11th Fd Regt in 5CAD its number was 54. Would it have carried the same number when it was badged as the 11th Army Field Regt? Also would its formation sign have been that of the 8th Army?

Thanks for the help.

John

[Doug Knight]

I checked the history of 11th field and I found no reference to SP guns, although the history is vague. However, since they were equipped with 25-pounders on the arrival in Italy and there are references to unthreaded barrels and muzzle brakes and quads and trailers thoroughout the history, I have ruled out Priests and Sextons.

The Gunners of Canada claim that they were a Priest regiment at the end of the war, but it makes the same claim for 8th Field and they were clearly Sexton at that time, So the GoC is suspect. My interest is the Sexton regiments, so I will check the war diary at some point and if I change my mind, I will let you know.

At this point, I think that 11th field were a towed 25-pounder regiment at least from 1943 onwards.

[Mark W. Tonner]

Hi John;

I agree with Doug, in Italy, at least, the 11th was a towed 25pdr regiment. There is nothing regarding them having been an SP regiment in Italy.

Cheers

[John McGillivray]

Thank you for the replies. I am still wondering about the reference to the 24 Sextons in the CMHQ report. Maybe it is refering to the Sextons recieved by 8th Field in 1945.

[Doug Knight]

I checked the war diary for 11th field and there is no indication that they were anything but a towed 25-pounder regiment. They are still talking about trailers after the arrival in Germany.

Sexton - As far as Canada was concerned, the original intention was to equip one regiment in each armoured regiment with Sextons. McNaughton ordered 84 guns immediately after the Larkhill trials in January 1943 and before the Brits adopted it (24 guns per regiment plus war stocks and training). things are a bit vague, but I think that Canada eventually paid for about 34 (?) guns, most of which stayed in Canada, and the Brits issued Sexton's to the CAOS as agreed/necessary.

19th Field received their Sextons in Canada and went to the UK as the SP regiment in 5th Armoured. They were considered to be too inexperienced to go to Italy with the division and were replaced by 8th field as the division SP regiment. The 8th were equipped with Priests in Italy by the Brits and then reequipped with Sextons when they moved to NWE in 1945.

19th became an Army field Regiment vice 8th field, were reequipped with Priests for the invasion (as were the 3 Div regiments) and returned to Sextons in late August 44.

23rd field is the only "pure" Cdn Sexton regiment. They trained on them in Canada, went to CAOS as the SP in 4th Armoured and used them throughout NWE.

So far as I know, only 8th, 19th, and 23rd were equipped with Sexton. Information is based on files in the National Archives and War Diaries. Gerry Nicholson has it wrong in the Gunners of Canada, but he may have been using the same source as Stacy in the CMHQ report.

Hope this helps.

Doug