Shell casing ID

[Richard Coutts-Smith]

Working on a Champ at the moment that has the coolest steering wheel. Can anyone ID what the shell casing was originally. I'm afraid it's all gobbeldygook to me.
Rich.

[Philliphastings]

It appears to be 2 Pounder Richard

Looks good whatever it was

Cheers

Phill

[Mike Cecil]

Richard,

Diameter, please. Looks like 18 pdr from the faint markings, but the diameter looks too small.

Markings appear to be quite elderly: much older than your 'Chump'

Mike C

[Richard Coutts-Smith]

Mike and Phil, thanks for your thoughts on this subject.
It will be a couple of weeks before I am back to this Champ (Mike you need to check your spelling, Chump indeed!)
Not sure that a diameter would be much help as it may well have been machined to fit, or at least to help the bog hold it in place.
I have a pic from another angle, but probably does not add much.
Rich.

[Tony Smith]

It's Italian made in 1939 for their 47mm Gun (MORE INFO), so probably a good chance it came back from North Africa.

This was a dual-role gun that was both an Infantry Gun and an Anti Tank gun. In Italian, "Anti-Tank Ammunition" is Munitzioni Anticarro. Perhaps that is the meaning of the MA (or AM?) cipher, or perhaps it is a specific munitions factory?

[Mike Cecil]

Tony,

Excellent! Thanks for that.

The 47/32 was encountered and used by Australians in the Middle East, and I think there is a captured example of the ugly little brute in the AWM's National Collection. It was on display in ANZAC Hall, adjacent to the CMP caravan, a few years ago but I think it is now back in storage at Mitchell.

The AWM image collection contains several images, eg 044455, 020088, 041998, 041999, P03799.017 which may be of interest to Richard.

Mike C

[Richard Coutts-Smith]

Great Tony, Thanks for that ID. This steering wheel has caused a bit of interest in various circles (Oh dear), and the first question is of course what shell it is.
Mike, thanks for the pics, certainly an Aussie connection with this artillery piece, quite sure the guy far left is hiding a shell casing behind his back!

DescriptionTOCRA, LIBYA. 1941-03 TO 1941-06. A CAPTURED ITALIAN 47MM ANTI-TANK GUN BEING INSPECTED BY AUSTRALIAN SOLDIERS.
http://cas.awm.gov.au/item/020088


Do you think this qualifies as Trench Art? Could be worth it's weight in Brass....
Rich.

[Bob Moseley (RIP)]

Hi Rich - as the title suggests you have a very cosmopolitan vehicle. Pommie truck with an Italian shell casing steering wheel centre. A very interesting combination of histories.

Bob

[Richard Coutts-Smith]

Yes Bob, not to mention ex-Aussie Army!
Shall I get in first with the Italian style 5 reverse gears....
Rich.

[Mike Cecil]

"Do you think this qualifies as Trench Art? ....."

Mate,

It's a Chump: the whole she-bang qualifies as 'Trench Art'! (But that's just my twisted opinion....)

Mike C

[Tony Smith]

The Wikipedia article I linked to above provides a pic of an existing example at CFB Borden. While more probably linked to the Italian Campaign rather than North Africa, the Canadian example appears to have non-original wheels. Does anyone think they look like inside-out Carrier wheels? Compare to the AWM pic of the 7 spoke originals.

[Bob Moseley (RIP)]

Rich - I am mortified that you would think I would make a disparaging remark about your unique vehicle that has five reverse gears. They only had those gears to confuse the enemy.

Bob

[drcowie]

These pics show the AP round (base fuse) adjacent to 2Pr A/A (Pom Pom) in my collection.

[Richard Coutts-Smith]

Well, now we know what the rest looked like. Looks kinda bare without a steering wheel wrapped around it.
Thanks Des
Rich.