Bracebridge Field Gun

[RichCam]

I was out and about this week in Bracebridge. I stopped by the local Legion there and spied this under the tree at the side of the building. The Legion was closed and it didn't have a plaque on it. Would someone mind telling me what it is and when it would have been used? Maybe it is a restoration project that they could get behind in the near future.
Regards, Richard

[peter simundson]

German, 77 mm, WW1

Wheels not original

Peter S

[David Dunlop]

I think there is a similar one out in Kelowna, BC on the Armoury grounds.

David

[rob love]

I have one on stands outside the shop at work waiting for the wheels to be re-done. They are expected to be about $1500 or so each......a little more complicated than a normal wheel.

For a listing of all the monument guns (and aircraft and armour) across Canada, check out http://silverhawkauthor.com/

[John McGillivray]

There is also one in the Canadian War Museum and at the Brome County Museum in Knowlton Quebec

[rob love]

Looks like someone had to spike their gun. That's got to be demoralizing.

[John McGillivray]

Originally Posted by rob love

Looks like someone had to spike their gun. That's got to be demoralizing.

Or they had a premature.

[Grant Bowker]

The war museum used to claim (decades ago, not sure if they still say it) that the split barrel was the result of a freak hit by an enemy shell that entered the barrel before exploding. Your choice whether you go for myth or truth

[James P]

Take whatever the CWM says with a HUGE grain of salt as they are full of something.

[David Dunlop]

When a Browning .50 cal HB MG is worked hard, there is a risk of a 'cook off' when a round sits in the chamber.

Can the same thing happen with artillery if the crew is pushing rounds through their gun as quickly as possible during a heavy barrage, and can this be much more catastrophic?


David

[Lynn Eades]

Any m.g. that fires from a "closed bolt" can "cook off" If I recall correctly....
A cook off would just fire it with no damage to the gun, because the cook off is the result of the primer / propellent being set off from heat from the chamber.
I don't pretend to know much about this stuff, but if Rob wasn't right about spiking the gun, then I would suspect that this artillery piece was firing H.E. that for some reason prematurely exploded before the projectile exited the muzzle.
How far up the barrel will the shell primer push the projectile before it stops in the barrel? (no charge in shell?) What happens then if the projectile has had its fuze set? What determines when the fuze starts running?
Can an Arty guy educate me a bit?

[Dave Mills]

We had to report to the CP "Gun Loaded Gun Hot" when the No1 felt that the barrel was to hot and we had the gun loaded and "At my Command" in force. The fuses would only activate after the projectile completed 6 full revolutions; on a 105mm Howitzer M2A2 the projectile completed 1.5 rotations between the breech and the muzzle so would be at least 30 metres from the barrel when it armed for a timed fuse. A different ball game when working with the proximity fuse as you would set the time on the fuse to arm in its "time of flight" and it would detonate 20 metres above the ground showering the ground dwellers with plenty of red hot steel.

[Lynn Eades]

Thanks Dave, So what do you think happened?
I guess we need to know if this gun was loaded with a complete one piece shell charge projectile assy., or if they were separate components. I'd like to understand what happened.

[John McGillivray]

A premature explosion could result from a damaged or defective fuse. During war time production quality control may not always be what it should be.

The easiest way to damage a fuse is during loading, by missing the chamber and hitting the fuse on the breach ring. This happened once on a gun I was commanding. Needless to say we did not fire that round but packed it up and marked it “N/S damaged fuse”.

In the book “An Awesome Silence” by Eldon Davis there is an account of a 25 pdr gun crew killed (I think from 3Fd RCA) when a shell exploded as the loader threw the shell towards the chamber hitting the breach. The shell shouldn’t have exploded, but it did, so it must have being a defective fuse.

https://www.amazon.ca/awesome-silenc...wesome+Silence

[tankbarrell]

I suspect it was just as Rob stated, a crew spiked their gun. Likely a shell was fitted nose first into the muzzle and then a normal round fired using a long lanyard.

[Lynn Eades]

Thank you John and Adrian

[Chris Suslowicz]

Originally Posted by Lynn Eades

Thanks Dave, So what do you think happened?
I guess we need to know if this gun was loaded with a complete one piece shell charge projectile assy., or if they were separate components. I'd like to understand what happened.

The other thing to remember is that this is apparently a WW1 gun. Fuse technology was nowhere near as advanced as WW2 and the ammunition was probably not 'bore safe' as (with a few notable exceptions) it is now. It might be a premature detonation (fuse failure or badly-filled shell), an obstructed barrel, or deliberate destruction to deny it to the enemy.

Deliberate destruction would probably be done at the breech end, to ensure maximum damage, especially if you have the WW1 time delay fuses that relied on ignition by flame getting past the shell on firing. (Put a shell into the breech backwards, add some delay fuse, light and run away.)

The damage looks like a detonation in the barrel, and I would not like to have been present when it happened. (I have been present when various firework mortars have prematured[1]; that is quite bad enough, thank you, and I have no wish to repeat the experience.)

Chris.
[1] Cardboard or HDPE tubes, papier-mache (or plastic) shells; the two memorable ones were a 6" mine (built as a spherical shell with no time delay) which removed the top 18" of the tube we fired it from, and a 4" Maltese cylinder maroon that went off in the tube, producing an 'interesting' crater and probably some permanent hearing damage. It was certainly the loudest noise I'd ever experienced (being about 12 feet away from the bang).

[Michael R.]

If this gun was one of the official items from the government collection, the Controller of War Throphies records will show make, calibre, and serial number as well as where, when, and by whom the gun was captured. It may also indicate the dates the gun was transferred to the UK; what ship was used to bring it to Canada, and where it was stored before being awarded. (i.e. Canadian National Exhibition, c.1920)


Perhaps the record will also provide details regarding the burst barrel? It is quite likely the Canadian War Museum has the original record. . . .


It would be intersting to see why Bracebridge received a 77, vs a larger gun. It may be related to the number of war dead from that particular area, but the award may not have been limited to this single gun.

With the 100th Anniversary approaching, would it be an appropriate time to clean the gun up and display it in a prominent location with the Bracebridge Memorial plaque?

Patriotic enthusiasim appears to have time limits.

[rob love]

The CWM has a few different captions for the destroyed gun. One caption reads:

Artillery Piece
Canadian soldiers captured this 77mm German field gun during the Battle of Vimy Ridge in April 1917. The German gunners rendered it
inoperable by destroying the muzzle.
Breech
Loading Rifled Artillery Piece CWM 19390002-221

http://www.warmuseum.ca/firstworldwa...aterials_e.pdf



Another reads:
A symbol of Victory

Canadian Infantry captured this 77 millimetre gun
during the attack on Vimy Ridge. It is unclear how it's muzzle was destroyed. One source claims that the German gunners attempted to destroy their own gun before it fell into Canadian hands, exploding a shell in the muzzle, but were killed before they could escape.

https://www.flickr.com/photos/sarge_...n/photostream/