The 25 lb Gun

[FuglyFreddy]

I remember reading online somewhere that almost all the 25 lb. field guns used by Commonwealth forces in World War Two were produced right here in Canada. Can anybody verify this and perhaps provide some background info? Some weblinks would be nice too.

[Marc Montgomery]

Many, but certainly not all, were produced by Sorel Industries Ltd
of Sorel Quebec.

If you look on the guns often used as gate guards or cenotaph pieces, or in front of legions, you'll likely see stamping and data plates saying SIL indicating it was/is a Cdn made gun.

The southern Ontario based group L:imber Gunners Association operates a fully restored Gun tractor, limber and 25pdr.
(Toronto Oshawa area)

Their website is
http://www.geocities.com/lga25ubique/index.html

Cheers
Marc -editor Convoy Magazine- the world's #1 magazine for CMP and other Canadian military vehicle buffs
http://www.geocities.com/convoymagazine

[FuglyFreddy]

Thanks for the reply, Marc. Do you have any idea of the overall proportion of Commonwealth equipment that was Canadian-made?

[Marc Montgomery]

Sorry havent found exact production numbers but
SIL was the major gun manufacturer in Canada.
They not only made 25 pdr during war but also a couple of 12pdr naval guns types. Post war they made 105 howitzers and other types of naval guns.

Part 1 of an article on SIL appears in Convoy #13 just out.

Interesting story. As was often the case in Canada, we went from little to no experience in war materiel manufacture, to completed items in just a matter of months.

In this case, (prime example) there were no buildings AT ALL and no experience AT ALL....
and in a matter of months a HUGE building had gone up, and they were beginning to turn out 25pdrs from scrap metal and ore to highly technical metalurgical parts. Amazing!

The plant is virtually intact and still recognizable, (although occupied by several smaller firms) with only one of the large sections "abandoned".

Sadly, there's nothing -nada- zip- to indicate anywhere that this was one of THE prime armaments manufacture in Canada, and indeed the Commonwealth!

The only 25pdr I could see was tucked away at the little legion and even then, nothing to indicate that this was where they were made!!!!!!! incredible!!!

Cheers
Marc
http://www.geocities.com/convoymagazine
http://www.geocities.com/lga25ubique/index.html
CONVOY/LGA/CMP/Thank You Canada- forum
CONVOY- for the true CMP fan, and student of Cdn military history

[RC SIGS]

6% of the 177,000 artillery weapons made by the good guys during WWII (including USA) were made in Canada. That is 1/6th of British production and 1/10th of USA. If you want to remove the USA portion, 6% x 10, do the math.

SIL actually had a contract with the British Government to make 25 pdrs before the war started.I believe the quantity ordered was 100. If I remember right the information is available on the web from DHH. Marc I also believe I posted the information on your web site during a discussion with Gary Shipton.

[Alex Blair (RIP)]

GM alone produced the 25pounder at RIL in Regina,Browing machine guns at Border Industries Limited in Windsor,Sexton Hulls in the Walkerville plant,Bofor parts and assemblies in Oshawa,not to mention any vehicle production,plus half tracks at the Internationl plant in Hamilton and Browning pistols and machine guns at the John Inglis Washing Machine Company in Toronto..
That is just a few of the war effort Canadian production facilities I can think of..
Canada today has a huge production percentage of weaponary in the domestic product number..
LAV's out of London..
A robust military electronics industry out of Ottawa..
M1A1 Abrhams upgrades .
Laser guided electronics..
Communications..
On and On....
C-7's out of Cambridge(?).....

[Marc Montgomery]

As you know Alex from the 2-part story in CONVOY Magazine issues #10 and #11, RIL in Regina produced 2pdr and quickly thereafter, the 6pdr AT guns.

The first part of the SIL story and 25pdr production in Canada appeared in issue #13. The plant had a somewhat disorganized setup due to French methods in a North American setting and when France capitulated, the French staff returned home fearing Nazi reprisals against their families.

Chrysler Canada executives were called in to re-organize and turn the plant around which they did, resulting in a very efficient operation and successful and highly productive operation.

Funny how things work out. Issue 9 has a fabulous photo of the LGA 25pdr on the cover (courtesy D. Lawrence) and issue 13 has a great photo of the 6pdr memorial (courtesy me)

cheers
Marc
http://www.geocities.com/convoymagazine
http://www.geocities.com/lga25ubique/index.html
Canadian heritage military vehicle forum

[Doug Knight]

According to Canadian Arsenals, SIL produced 1,684 towed 25-pr and 2,097 SP 25-pr during WW2. I have seen other figures, but considering the source, these should be pretty accurate.

The 25-pr was produced in the UK, Canada and Australia. I have seen 12,253 for British production and the only Aussie count I have is 200 of the "short' model. The Canadian Army in Britain was supplied from British production and many of the guns produced in Canada for the UK were sent to meet British committments elsewhere. This was coordinated to keep shipping space to a minimum.

Has anyone actually seen a 25-pr with the breech marking "C Mark III"?

[Tony Smith]

There were 1527 25pdr's made in Australia and 212 Short 25pdr's, a total of 1739 guns, plus a number of spares and ammunition trailers. I don't know if this number includes the 25pdr pieces used on Yeramba self propelled guns and on the AC3 Sentinels.