Mystery Radiator

Eric Szalanda · #1 09-05-07, 14:07

I recently aquired a "Ford Blitz " radiator. Upon closer inspection, it would appear to be out of something else. The part number is not a Blitz number - Should be 8000 series, as stated in the Parts List.
The bottom outlets don;t have drains, a la Bren carrier. the top bracket is original build, but I din't think that the cap housong extension is. Ford Lynx or Aussie Dingo maybe?

Eric Szalanda · #2 09-05-07, 14:09

Another one

Eric Szalanda · #3 09-05-07, 14:10

More

Eric Szalanda · #4 09-05-07, 14:12

Hey Ian, this is easy.
I just had to get the 600 X 450 size right!

Tony Smith · #5 09-05-07, 14:58

C81T is a Canadian built 1938 Ford Commercial Truck. Could be either 134"wb or 158. The steel tab around the filler cap was to mount brace rods that went back to the cab/cowl.

Alex Blair (RIP) · #6 09-05-07, 18:33

Quote:

Originally posted by Tony Smith
C81T is a Canadian built 1938 Ford Commercial Truck. Could be either 134"wb or 158. The steel tab around the filler cap was to mount brace rods that went back to the cab/cowl.

Tony ...
According to my bible it will fit a 101..134--157...191"wb 1939-40-41 COMMERCIAL FORD and a 40-41 COE Ford commercial truck..
Canadian Built

Pedr · #7 09-05-07, 19:12

Eric, Mate.....don't believe what anyone else tells you ( Except maybe Tony

....sometimes! hehehe )....that is a genuine carrier radiator for an Aussie LP2/2a.

The number one tell tale is that the bottom outlets ( without drain taps ) are LOWER than the bottom tank. Blitz radiators are halfway below the bottom tank and half protruding from the back of the tank. Early truck radiators come straight out of the back of the bottom tank.

Another big telltale is the overflow pipe. About three inches from the neck of the radiator there is a brass nipple braised on, and in the case of your radiator it has obviously been bent straight instead of bending back on itself. This is where the overflow pressure valve screws on.

You are also missing the clamps for the choke and throttle cables.

For some unknown reason, many people think these radiators are Blitz Tropical Core Radiators. Most of the true Blitz Tropo Cores that I have seen have a fluted top tank. A long one-piece overflow pipe that runs down the side of the radiator, and bottom outlets that are half-in, half-out of the bottom tank.

Pedr

pics to follow later

Tony Smith · #8 10-05-07, 02:13

Quote:

Originally posted by Pedr
.....don't believe what anyone else tells you ( Except maybe Tony ....sometimes! hehehe

Trust me, I'm a MLU'er!

Here's another rad, this one was pulled from a 1941 MCP at Kingaroy. Interestingly, the part code is LC81T - Could the "L" indicate local (Aust) manufacture?

Tony Smith · #9 10-05-07, 02:19

Quote:

Originally posted by Pedr
that is a genuine carrier radiator for an Aussie LP2/2a.

The number one tell tale is that the bottom outlets ( without drain taps ) are LOWER than the bottom tank. Blitz radiators are halfway below the bottom tank and half protruding from the back of the tank. Early truck radiators come straight out of the back of the bottom tank.

The 38/39/40/41 trucks had downward angled outlets on the lower tank. The casting on these is marked 79-8087.

(Building work postponed due to rain yet again!)

Tony Smith · #10 10-05-07, 02:31

Quote:

Originally posted by Pedr
Another big telltale is the overflow pipe. About three inches from the neck of the radiator there is a brass nipple braised on, and in the case of your radiator it has obviously been bent straight instead of bending back on itself. This is where the overflow pressure valve screws on.

For some unknown reason, many people think these radiators are Blitz Tropical Core Radiators. Most of the true Blitz Tropo Cores that I have seen have a fluted top tank. A long one-piece overflow pipe that runs down the side of the radiator, and bottom outlets that are half-in, half-out of the bottom tank.

The MCP that I removed this from had a condenser can similar to a Blitz at the end of the overflow pipe. It had a steel jam nut on the steel tank, rusted on solid, so I had to cut the pipe end to remove it.

This top tank has flutes on it, is it a Troppo Core?? ($$!!)

The filler cap is fairly low profile and doesn't have the extension like Eric's. I don't know which version would be "Better", or who/why it might have been done.

Eric Szalanda · #11 10-05-07, 14:04

Tony,
yours is a good explanation, except that the bottom tank outlets are low dowwn like a blitz, where as mine has ones similar to a bren, with no drains.
It has a couple of holes in the bottom outlets which I will repair to see if the radiator will hold water. If It does, I will probably use the core only on my F15A, and swap the tanks over.

Pedr · #12 10-05-07, 16:46

Gentlemen,

Apparently this is starting to get a little out of hand. So I will impart my knowledge and understanding ( not that this is necessarily correct )

To explain my picture and theory.

Picture 1. This is what I believe the bottom outlets for a MCP should look like. My understanding is that the radiator mounts lower than the chassis rails and the fan isn't mounted on the generator but on a '42 style carrier fan bracket, that mounts the fan upside down to the carrier.... and therefore inside the perimeter of the fan belts.

Picture 2. I have most often seen this type fitted to CMP's ( Blitzes ) whereby the engine mounts are on a chassis crossmember and just below the top face of the chassis rails. In this type of installation the bottom outlets are aligned with the water pumps. If this style of outlet is mounted in a carrier, it will be found that the outlets for the engine and radiator aren't aligned ( Salesman Bob can confirm this, as can Alan Newton and Reg Chapman...all whom found the same problem )

Picture 3. Presumed to be carrier type. The lower bottom outlets align with the water pumps on the carrier mountings. This type is commonly fitted in CMP's but requires slightly bent bottom hoses. This was the case with the FGT 8 (Aust) in the South Australian museum before the radiator was swapped with the non-fitting one from the carrier ( 2340 ). Bob sold a radiator fitted to a Blitz to a club member in SA that turned out to be this style. It also had the choke and throttle brackets fitted on the top tank outlets.

Pedr · #13 10-05-07, 16:59

This is the radiator from the Paris Creek Blitz that Bob M wrecked for parts. This radiator was sold to a club member whom subsequently modified it to fit in an unrelated Ford powered vehicle. ( long story )

Pedr · #14 10-05-07, 17:22

As you can see, the top of the bottom outlets lines up ( roughly ) with the bottom of the tank.

Pedr · #15 10-05-07, 17:33

This is a cropped picture of the top tank overflow pipe. As you can see the pipe is about 3" long and has a male nipple braised on the end.

Carrier radiators that have been rebirthed for use in other vehicles usually either still have this nipple and an extension screwed on or have had the nipple cut off and a new piece of pipe braised on to the end of it.

This pipe has usually been straightened to follow the original pressed path for this overflow pipe, but close inspection will usually show an original paint mark where the pipe left the pressed channel as it was bent to head toward the overflow pressure valve.

Pedr · #16 10-05-07, 18:10

Just as a comparison.

The top radiator is a definate radiator for a carrier ( Aust )

The bottom is the one Eric is attempting to identify

Pedr · #17 10-05-07, 18:14

You'll see where this is going soon....I hope.

Pedr · #18 10-05-07, 18:20

Using the previous pictures as comparison.

Here is Eric's radiator, with some points of interest.

Pedr

Pedr · #19 10-05-07, 18:48

Ok so you now have all of the information that I have.

Unfortunately I don't have any pictures of type 1 or type 2 radiators in-situ, to prove my theorem. Perhaps others have some pictures that they can post.

What I do know however, is that Salesman Bob apparently purchased Natrad's final tropical core off the shelf a couple of years ago for the SA museums carrier, meaning that all recores in the future will have to be made as required at a rough price of $1200.

I am still saving for mine. :dh:

Finally, here's a radiator in place in carrier 5000. Not that you can see either the overflow pipe or the bottom outlets.

Pedr

PS Tony, Tropical cores are about 5" thick and have a tapers on the front face 3" from the edge on both sides. Ordinary cores don't have the tapers and are only as thick as the sides of the radiator ( approx. 3" ). see Eric's first picture in this thread.

Stuart Kirkham · #20 11-05-07, 00:49

I'm impressed Pedr, your detective skills are first class.

I find this forum fascinating as it is never short of answers to 'tricky' questions.

Lynn Eades · #21 11-05-07, 08:08

Std. radiators are flat right across the full width of the radiator.
The tropical cores have the extra row of tubes in the front which gives the tropical cores the bevelled front look.

Tony Smith · #22 27-01-08, 11:48

If in doubt, consult the parts book:

Paul Singleton · #23 27-01-08, 15:16

I was surprised to see that most of the radiators shown in the pictures have severely corroded lower outlets. The cab 12 that I sold to David Moore was corroded in the same way and until now I had not realized that this was a common problem.
Paul