Panzerjager Bren

[konigstiger]

Does anyone have any pictures of the Panzerjager Bren. They were captured bren carriers that were used as tank hunters. They were armed with 3 88mm Raketenpanzerbuchse 43 or 54 rocket launchers mounted on the engine compartment. Also panzerfausts were carried for use by the crew.
does anyone have any pictures? I only have 2

[Mark W. Tonner]

Hi Michael;

The Panzerjager Bren.

Cheers

[Geoff Winnington-Ball (RIP)]

Ask and ye shall receive, Michael... this place is like that...

[dougiebarder]

Can I have a free quad , limber and 25 pounder, and a nice wireless truck please.

[Geoff Winnington-Ball (RIP)]

Originally posted by dougiebarder
Can I have a free quad , limber and 25 pounder, and a nice wireless truck please.

Sure... right after someone delivers me my T-16...

[Snowtractor]

they deliver my Ram Skink...stop,no return!
Sean

[dougiebarder]

At least we're in the cue then:idea:

[Mark W. Tonner]

Originally posted by dougiebarder
Can I have a free quad , limber and 25 pounder, and a nice wireless truck please

Originally posted by Geoff Winnington-Ball
Sure... right after someone delivers me my T-16

Originally posted by Snowtractor
they deliver my Ram Skink...stop,no return!

For dougiebarder; Geoff and Snowtractor.......

Sorry, batteries not included........

Mark do we have any idea where these carriers came from. I know the 48th dumped thier carrier in the harbour with the engines running in 1940.

[konigstiger]

Thanks Mark
Art: my guess they just used ones captured or abandoned in the field or maybe at Dunkirk or some other place similar, but they must have captured quite a few because they are many varities.

And if everyone else is getting a vehicle, i'll put an order in for a couple shermans and carriers, make one of them a panzerjager bren ok?

[Mark W. Tonner]

Originally posted by Art Johnson
Mark do we have any idea where these carriers came from.

Hi Art;

No, sorry, there is no reference given, they may have come from captured/abandoned stock in France and the Low Countries or they may have come from the Middle East/Med. theatre or captured from the Soviets (lend-lease). The Germans seem to have been masters at salvage, so they may have come from anywhere.

Cheers

[Geoff Winnington-Ball (RIP)]

Originally posted by Mark W. Tonner
For dougiebarder; Geoff and Snowtractor.......

Sorry, batteries not included........

OK, you're TOAST... I was protecting you from but now I'm going to let her loose on you...

[Mark W. Tonner]

Originally posted by Geoff Winnington-Ball
OK, you're TOAST... I was protecting you from but now I'm going to let her loose on you...

I knew I should have got you a pre-painted T16 instead of a black & white one...oh well, maybe can help you paint it, no, that won't work, there is no numbers on it, so she won't know where to paint which colour....oh well, I tried........

[Keith Webb]

Better duck, Marko I can sense a frying pan headed your way!

As for me, a No 8 FGT would do nicely, please...

[greg anderson (RIP)]

If I may get back to the original subject--I took pictures at a militaria gettogether in Florida of a German half track which appear to have used the bogies and suspension of a bren carrier but the track and sprocket are different than mine and the bogies are solid discs not spoked--the owner told me it was made up in part from bits of carriers left at Dunkirk-it was very well restored as a cargo carrier -if anyone is interested I could try to scan and post these--Greg

Originally posted by Snowtractor
they deliver my Ram Skink...stop,no return!
Sean

Well, you have a Skink turret over there and we have a Ram chassis over here.

I think "suit keen DIYer" would be appropriate.

R.

[Hanno Spoelstra]

Originally posted by greg anderson
I took pictures at a militaria gettogether in Florida of a German half track which appear to have used the bogies and suspension of a bren carrier but the track and sprocket are different than mine and the bogies are solid discs not spoked--the owner told me it was made up in part from bits of carriers left at Dunkirk-it was very well restored as a cargo carrier

Greg, that was Maultier you saw. Yes, the track setup was clearly patterned on the Bren/Universal/Loyd Carrier, but the conversion was carried out with purpose-built components. Read more about them in the thread "CMP Half Track" (scroll down to my posting about the Maultier).
I'd love to see the pictures you took of this interesting beast and I wonder if the one you saw was a Ford- or Opel-based one.

Thanks,
Hanno

[Snowtractor]

Originally posted by FV623
Well, you have a Skink turret over there and we have a Ram chassis over here.

I think "suit keen DIYer" would be appropriate.

R.

Hmmm, and float it over in a Stolly. We have access to the ocean, via the Mackenzie and Slave Rivers ,would you mind delivering it to the boat launch Richard... Tea and caribou on me, maybe Alex can send up some sauteed squirrel nuts:
Sean

[Hanno Spoelstra]

Originally posted by FV623
I think "suit keen DIYer" would be appropriate.

I think the greenery shooting up around it gives us a hint - "flower pot"

Mind you, an M3 in not much better condition is being made to run again in the UK. But I can't see why one would waste perfectly good running gear components on making a rusty piece of Swiss cheese mobile again :

H.

[Mark W. Tonner]

Originally posted by Art Johnson
Mark do we have any idea where these carriers came from. I know the 48th dumped thier carrier in the harbour with the engines running in 1940.

Hi Art;

This is from the source of the two pictures I posted of Panzerjager Bren:

under Great Britain, it says:

"In North Africa, a small number of British vehicles were captured from time to time. These were used by DAK (Deutsches Afrika Korps) until they were lost. Matilda tanks could only be lost through lack of maintenance because no British gun was capable of destroying them.

On the Atlantic Wall in France and The Low Countries during 1942 and 1943, a small number of British armoured vehicles were converted to self-propelled guns. These vehicles came from the stockpiles remaining since Dunkirk in 1940. They were used only by local garrison units in the areas of these stockpile dumps. Again, after the Invasion in July 1944, a small number of British vehicles were used by the German units which captured them."

it also goes on to say that:

"The Germans utilized captured carriers for many purposes, as tractors and ammunition carriers. A small number were made into Panzerjagers"

Notes regarding BEF vehicle losses in France 1940, from History of the Second World War, United Kingdom Military Series, The War in France and Flanders 1939-1940:

"By the time fighting ended, most of the armoured fighting vehicles - tanks, armoured cars and carriers - and considerable quantities of transport, arms and equipment had been destroyed in action or damaged in conditions which made their repair impossible. But all artillery, vehicles, equipment and stores that reached the coast with the main British Expeditionary Force had to be destroyed or left behind and .....In subsequent evacuations from ports south of the Somme some stores and equipment were brought away, but much was left behind."

it goes on to give the following figures:

under 'Shipped to France (September 1939-May 1940)', it says:

Vehicles 68,618

under 'Consumed and expended in action or destroyed or left behind', it says:

Vehicles 63,879

It does not state however, how many of the 'Vehicles' were carriers, just the totals '68,618' and '63,879'.

If I find anymore information regarding carriers 'salvaged' by the Germans from France 1940, I'll post it here.

Cheers

[greg anderson (RIP)]

Hanno;--Re your post above,the vehicle in Florida was the same as shown in your post and closer scrutiny seems to indicate that it was completely German built and did not use carrier suspension--unfortunately the 2 photos I took were of the track arrangment only and I cannot recall the truck -Greg

[Mark W. Tonner]

Originally posted by konigstiger
Does anyone have any pictures of the Panzerjager Bren. They were captured bren carriers that were used as tank hunters. They were armed with 3 88mm Raketenpanzerbuchse 43 or 54 rocket launchers mounted on the engine compartment. Also panzerfausts were carried for use by the crew.
does anyone have any pictures? I only have 2

Hi Michael;

Apparently, the Panzerjager Bren was a creation of the 3rd PanzerGrenadier Division. They were formed in France in July 1943 (formerly the 3rd Motorized Infantry Division - destroyed in Russia in 1943 - reformed in France as the 3rd PanzerGrenadier Division). After formation they were sent to Italy and then Russia again, finally surrendering to the Americans in the Ruhr. I don't have any figure regarding the number of Panzerjager Bren that they actually held/operated, but they seem to be the only German formation who used them.

Cheers

[Bob Moseley (RIP)]

Hi all
Although not directly related to the above vehicle but just for interest, here is an image of a German Air ID Chart relating to the identification of British Carriers. At least the German is common to this thread.
Bob

[konigstiger]

Thanks everyone for the info, it will be a lot of help.