Guy Ant gs truck in BEF

[phantom16]

Hi,

were the Guy Ant gs trucks already used by the British Expeditionary Force in 1940?
Thanks.

regards,

Dennis

[David_Hayward (RIP)]

I have no proof but I am sure that this was the case as obviously Morris-Commercial CS8 equivalents were sent over as were Bedford MWs I believe.

I am in touch with a chap who has a lot of photographs and film of wartime Guys, and I shall ask him if he has any photos of Ants on the Continent.

[Rob Beale]

David,
do you have information on Guy Ants sent to NZ in WW2

There are a few survivors, only 2 restored that I know of.

thanks
Rob

[Lynn Eades]

The owner of one is a member of this forum.

[David_Hayward (RIP)]

Nothing so far but it would seem likely at this stage without delving further that they were part of any North African deliveries sold to the NZ Government in 1941, that were then shipped out after the campaign, or were sold around 1944 along with surplus MCC and Chevrolet trucks. By then the Ministry of Supply had settled on 4 x 4 trucks, and conversions were under way for older 4 x 4 FATs to G/S trucks.

David Fletcher of the Tank Museum mentions:

S4532 which is dated 21.9.43 was for the conversion of 1. No WD number is given but the card reads Prototype conversion of “Quad” Ant 4x4 FAT to truck 15cwt 4x4 (Tractor ex-Guys Contract T12774) To be consigned to WVEE Farnbororough, Hamoshire.

S4882 is dated 29.10.43 for 12 vehicles described as Tractor 4x4 (6 Pdr) A/T; Tyres 10.50x20. It then says Chassis for these vehicles are to be produced ex-WD current production for FA Tractors from Contract T12774. and WD number group is H5330808 to 5330819. Chassis nos. QA 26708 – 26719.

Contract T12774 is dated 10.4.42 for some 700 vehicles described as Truck 15 cwt 4x4 GS (body all steel) “Quad Ant”. WD numbers are Z5330073, 083, 092-807 and in this case the notes read 20 extra vehicles produced under same contract as Tractors 4x4 FA. 1 extra vehicle converted, see contract S4532 WD No. Z 5330095. So what we seem to have here is a contract for four-wheel drive 15 cwt trucks replacing Quad Ant Field Artillery Tractors, none of which explains anything about S4882 except that those 12 vehicles came from the earlier contract."

I believe that the Ministry were ordering rebuilds and conversions of obsolete Guy Quad Ant tractors at the same time as the MCC CS8 quads and derivatives, as well as the Chevrolet 2-pdr and 6-pdr Portees. We know that NZ got MCC CS8s and 2-pdr Chevrolets, which were obviously not required, so 4 x 2 Ants would have been truly surplus...getting rid of them to the colonials makes a whole lot of sense.

[Rob Beale]

I had first thought they were early war purchases.
The plate above the steering column on one survivor here in Gisborne NZ reads:
Contract No. 94/V/4528(Con.8)
Catalogue Ref No 90

Does this mean anything to you?

I note from info supplied to me that the 'Z' Census number on the Isle of Wight survivor is less than 100 before a restored New Zealand survivor.

The attached image was taken some years ago, but it is now safely stored inside!
Rob

ps Lynn, I have renewed contact with said member!!

[David_Hayward (RIP)]

Contract V.4528 = Z 4645001 - 4647000 "Truck 15-cwt 4 x 2 G/S"

which would have been placed around September 1943, and I am loathe to ask Mr Fletcher to look up the record card but perhaps I can get round to it myself in due course. I have applied to be a volunteering job on record cards at the Tank Museum. In the meantime I wonder if "con.8" means some form of conversion? This was as just mentioned a time of flux as regards contracts, and 4 x 2 was obsolete, old Tractors were obsolete, and the huge backlog of Canadian vehicles stockpiled across the Pond was at last starting to clear. The requirement for 17-pdr tractors resulted in 4 x 4 GT rebuilds, and what was left was it seems either converted into G/S trucks or 17-pdr tractors, or at least sent to New Zealand where they were rebuilt as G/S trucks! The shipping of the 4 x 2 Ants supplied under V.4528 therefore makes a whole lot of sense.

May I ask our Aussie friends if there is any evidence that the British sold any obsolete vehicles to the Australian Government as well? I have realised that in this thread
http://www.mapleleafup.org/forums/sh...r&pagenumber=2

we discussed such matters, although the MCC Portees could either have been assigned to the AIF in North Africa and then shipped home after the campaign, or sold on ex-WD stocks as obsolete.

I was also going to ask if anyone had any evidence of the Chevrolet Portees being converted to G/S trucks as well as of course the 17-pdr Tractors, and there is the photo evidence!

[Dave Page]

Hi Everyone,
said 1943 Guy "Ant" Z4646406 has been sold and is now under new stewardship but still in NZ. If I recall correctly there were 20 to 22 Guy "Ant"s shipped to N.Z. most were G.S. but I have seen one chassis in Auckland that was all that remained of a "Wireless-Ant". Of the NOS parts I sold with the truck, a set of drums was tagged for shipment to Fiji, which suggests there was at least one there during the war.
As for service with the B.E.F., I worked with a Scottish chap that lived in Hamilton, N.Z. who was with the B.E.F. as part of a M.G. section. His truck was an "Ant". The truck took a direct hit from a Stuka and he was captured, spending the remainder of the war interred. You can only imagine the look on his face when 50 years later he got to sit behind the wheel of another "Ant".
Cheers,
Dave

[Dave Page]

Hi Everyone,
said 1943 Guy "Ant" Z4646406 has been sold and is now under new stewardship but still in NZ. If I recall correctly there were 20 to 22 Guy "Ant"s shipped to N.Z. most were G.S. but I have seen one chassis in Auckland that was all that remained of a "Wireless-Ant". Of the NOS parts I sold with the truck, a set of drums was tagged for shipment to Fiji, which suggests there was at least one there during the war.
As for service with the B.E.F., I worked with a Scottish chap that lived in Hamilton, N.Z. who was with the B.E.F. as part of a M.G. section. His truck was an "Ant". The truck took a direct hit from a Stuka and he was captured, spending the remainder of the war interred. You can only imagine the look on his face when 50 years later he got to sit behind the wheel of another "Ant".
Cheers,
Dave

[Les Freathy]

A picture of Kaput trucks in Le Harve in 1940 , incudes a couple of Ants
Les

[David_Hayward (RIP)]

I am sure that the Wehrmacht were very grateful for the kind generosity. And thanks Les for the definitive proof!

[phantom16]

that pic was just what I was looking for, may thanks.

regards,

Dennis