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  #1  
Old 07-03-14, 18:39
arie teomim arie teomim is offline
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Default cross tube remove

HI ALL,
Im trying to take out the cross tube. alraedy took out the bogies, but its stuck. did I miss any thing??
thanks arie
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  #2  
Old 07-03-14, 18:44
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RichardT10829 RichardT10829 is offline
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No it's a nightmare.... Pull the rollers off the inside of the hull they come out with one bolt, then remove the castings from the hull wall so they don't get damaged.... Slide them along the tube out of harms way so you have a bit room to move, remove the cam plate, then put a brass dolly in the end of the tube and give it a good whack...

Did mine not so long ago

http://www.mapleleafup.net/forums/sh...=12965&page=12
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__5th Div___46th Div__
1942 Ford Universal Carrier No.3 MkI*
Lower Hull No. 10131
War Department CT54508 (SOLD)
1944 Ford Universal Carrier MkII* (under restoration).
1944 Morris C8 radio body (under restoration).
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  #3  
Old 08-03-14, 23:38
SDeMocko SDeMocko is offline
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Default Cross Tube Problems

Arie,

Sometimes you just need to beat something into submission. These photos are meant to inspire. My cross tube was welded to the brackets. As much as I tried I could not cut the parts free. I finally ended up cutting through into three pcs. I repaired all three parts buy building up damage and machining back. I also bored all three parts for an interference fit on a sleeve. After sleeving all three parts back together I plug and butt welded. Good luck pulling your tube out. I hope you don't need to resort to such extreme measures.

Stephen
'44 MKII
Attached Thumbnails
photo 2.jpg   photo 1.jpg   photo 13.JPG   photo 12.jpg  
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  #4  
Old 08-03-14, 23:41
SDeMocko SDeMocko is offline
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Default Cross Tube Problems

A few more pics.
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photo 10.jpg   photo 8.jpg   photo 9.jpg   photo 4.jpg  
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  #5  
Old 08-03-14, 23:44
SDeMocko SDeMocko is offline
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Default Cross Tub Problems

Finally Back together.
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photo 7.JPG   photo 6.jpg   photo 11.jpg  
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  #6  
Old 09-03-14, 00:03
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I am having some serious lathe envy !

It must have been seriously seized that one.

Heating and quenching is another good trick but it would take some hellish heat soak into that cross tube to do the job.... You can also apply heat than melt paraffin wax between the surfaces.... Works a charm.

Getting the rollers out and the castings off the hull was the key in my case.
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is mos redintegro

__5th Div___46th Div__
1942 Ford Universal Carrier No.3 MkI*
Lower Hull No. 10131
War Department CT54508 (SOLD)
1944 Ford Universal Carrier MkII* (under restoration).
1944 Morris C8 radio body (under restoration).
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  #7  
Old 09-03-14, 00:05
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Lynn Eades Lynn Eades is offline
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Steve, mine was welded to the rollers and to the sides of the roller casting.
I had great difficulty as well, but manged to save my cross tube by sacrificing the roller and casting. I cut it into pieces.
The steering had been removed to use the carrier as a trailer. That's why it was welded.
Note the difference in the hole layout.
This is the pre universal carrier style which fortunately for me, was later adopted by the Australians in their LP2 carriers.
The differences being 1. used UNF thread. 2. The pin is drilled for lube to the bushes.

Arie, you should remove the cam plate (with the floor plate) first.
I found the left side casting to be more accessable to a grinder. There is still a lot of struggle involved. It would be much cheaper to freight two side roller assemblies than a cross tube. I would guess you could buy the side roller asemblies from one of the Canadian guys.

Good luck with your struggle!
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10270.jpg  
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Carrier Armoured O.P. No1 Mk3 W. T84991
Carrier Bren No2.Mk.II. NewZealand Railways. NZR.6.
Dodge WC55. 37mm Gun Motor Carriage M6
Jeep Mb #135668
So many questions....

Last edited by Lynn Eades; 09-03-14 at 00:25.
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  #8  
Old 09-03-14, 04:06
Michael R. Michael R. is offline
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Porta-power and out. Thanks to Stew Robertson.
Ensure you have the inner CTL 1623 washer off the tube, as it can be easily overlooked. If it is rusted in place it is quite effective at preventing removal of the cross tube.
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cross tube out Mon 24 Feb 2014 (b).jpg   cross tube out Mon 24 Feb 2014.jpg  
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Last edited by Michael R.; 09-03-14 at 04:24.
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  #9  
Old 09-03-14, 10:26
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Micheal do both those washers go on the inside between the bogey and the hull wall ?
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is mos redintegro

__5th Div___46th Div__
1942 Ford Universal Carrier No.3 MkI*
Lower Hull No. 10131
War Department CT54508 (SOLD)
1944 Ford Universal Carrier MkII* (under restoration).
1944 Morris C8 radio body (under restoration).
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  #10  
Old 09-03-14, 11:54
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Lynn Eades Lynn Eades is offline
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Richard,If I recall correctly (which may be in doubt) the bogey assembly goes between them. I would carefully check with string lines, and adjust accordingly. It must help.
I think the inner washer is thicker than the outer one.

Michael R. good pictures/info. thanks for posting.
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Carrier Armoured O.P. No1 Mk3 W. T84991
Carrier Bren No2.Mk.II. NewZealand Railways. NZR.6.
Dodge WC55. 37mm Gun Motor Carriage M6
Jeep Mb #135668
So many questions....

Last edited by Lynn Eades; 09-03-14 at 12:25.
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  #11  
Old 09-03-14, 13:18
arie teomim arie teomim is offline
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HI ALL.
thanks you very much.
I removed out the bolt of the roller, and now my qustion is- is possible to remove the roller now? i sisnt even try, I thought it was too big to get out.
thanks arie
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  #12  
Old 09-03-14, 13:22
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Arie, it should come out.
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Carrier Armoured O.P. No1 Mk3 W. T84991
Carrier Bren No2.Mk.II. NewZealand Railways. NZR.6.
Dodge WC55. 37mm Gun Motor Carriage M6
Jeep Mb #135668
So many questions....
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  #13  
Old 09-03-14, 13:43
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RichardT10829 RichardT10829 is offline
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As per Lynn, mine came out, you might need to get in there with a wire brush and clean off any build up that might be jamming the roller in situ.
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is mos redintegro

__5th Div___46th Div__
1942 Ford Universal Carrier No.3 MkI*
Lower Hull No. 10131
War Department CT54508 (SOLD)
1944 Ford Universal Carrier MkII* (under restoration).
1944 Morris C8 radio body (under restoration).
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  #14  
Old 09-03-14, 13:45
arie teomim arie teomim is offline
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one things that I must point- during all of the work I doing on my carrier, I keep beeing amazed from the fact that all wheels, bougies, roller, were not stuck as I expected. I was amazesed the first time when I pulld the carrier out from the place it was in the last few decades. I tryed to tow it and... there was no problem. I could tow it easy. eaven today, I puld out the bolt of the roller easy, it was not rusted, or stuck, and came out oily.
one of the uper of the trak was missing. luckly, I found onther donor, and ther too, I was able to pull out the axle easy, and there too, it was oily and
shining like new inside.
I guss this is thanks to method of the oiling system in the carrier. the oil, unlike greas, dose not dry.
arie
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  #15  
Old 09-03-14, 14:01
arie teomim arie teomim is offline
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as you can see in thw pic that Stephen posted, the casting is opened. is it modifyed??
in othe pic i see that the roller is partly covered.
arie
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  #16  
Old 09-03-14, 15:29
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Arie, I'm not sure what you mean.
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Carrier Armoured O.P. No1 Mk3 W. T84991
Carrier Bren No2.Mk.II. NewZealand Railways. NZR.6.
Dodge WC55. 37mm Gun Motor Carriage M6
Jeep Mb #135668
So many questions....
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  #17  
Old 09-03-14, 16:14
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Default Castings

Lynn I think he means the tin dust shield that sits on top of the casting to cover the roller, there is usually a grease nipple located in the middle to lubricate the roller. Both of mine were still in situ.

Arie you will need to remove them, also you need to take all weight off the centre axle so the hull probably needs to do onto axle stands (or safer use railway sleepers stacked up)

So far Michael R's method is looking the best...... Wish I had access to one when I did mine...... I felt like weeping with frustration but kept at it and it came out in the end.
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is mos redintegro

__5th Div___46th Div__
1942 Ford Universal Carrier No.3 MkI*
Lower Hull No. 10131
War Department CT54508 (SOLD)
1944 Ford Universal Carrier MkII* (under restoration).
1944 Morris C8 radio body (under restoration).
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  #18  
Old 09-03-14, 17:20
Michael R. Michael R. is offline
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As Lynn recalls, correctly, the TL 1623 and TL 1624 (or CTL) rings are located on either side of the double bogie assembly. The outer one is quite obvious, however, the inner one may be lurking close to the leather dust excluder. If it is not rusted in place, you should be good to go. A touch of heat and some lube works wonders. Don't forget to remove the leather dust excluder wiring!

There is no need to remove the TL 1613 cross tube rollers when re/re the cross tube. The procedure is published in the British AOP maintenance manual.
Attached Thumbnails
bogie bits 9 Macrh 14 1624 outside.jpg   bogie bits 9 March 14.jpg   bogie bits 9 March 14 1623 hiding.jpg   bogie bits 9 March 13 cross tube roller.jpg  
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  #19  
Old 09-03-14, 17:55
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I noticed just now, your bolt is the same as mine however on Stephens picture, his has a grease nipple in the end of it ? Is that a mk2 thing ?
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is mos redintegro

__5th Div___46th Div__
1942 Ford Universal Carrier No.3 MkI*
Lower Hull No. 10131
War Department CT54508 (SOLD)
1944 Ford Universal Carrier MkII* (under restoration).
1944 Morris C8 radio body (under restoration).
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  #20  
Old 09-03-14, 19:39
Michael R. Michael R. is offline
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I noticed just now, your bolt is the same as mine however on Stephens picture, his has a grease nipple in the end of it ? Is that a mk2 thing ?

Yes.

The C31UCW upgrade (MK-II*) starting battery relocation blocked access to the former cross tube roller zerk fitting location of the MK-I*. An extension (C31UCW 104347) was added, as well as the grease now entering into the roller pin. The bracket remains the same, the former zerk fitting hole is closed off with a bolt.
Attached Thumbnails
Bogie bits 9 March 14 MK-II bracket with MK-I dust cover overlay.jpg   cross tube removal 5.jpg   cross tube removal 6.jpg  

Last edited by Michael R.; 09-03-14 at 20:29.
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  #21  
Old 09-03-14, 20:01
SDeMocko SDeMocko is offline
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Default Cross Tube Problem

Arie,

Another problem I had was somewhere on the edge of one side of the shaft it had been damaged. It wasn't enough to visually notice but it made it near impossible to slide the assembles off the end. In the end I did what Michael R. did. I used jacks including a hydraulic porta-power to force the assemblies past and off the bad part of the shaft end. Later when I had the end in a lathe I cleaned up the bad area. Hope this helped.

P.S. Sorry about the picture orientation. It was fighting me just like it did when I was trying to get it off, but you get the idea.

Stephen
'44 MKII
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  #22  
Old 09-03-14, 21:11
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RichardT10829 RichardT10829 is offline
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Cross tubes probably one of the worst glum jobs on a carrier restoration.
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is mos redintegro

__5th Div___46th Div__
1942 Ford Universal Carrier No.3 MkI*
Lower Hull No. 10131
War Department CT54508 (SOLD)
1944 Ford Universal Carrier MkII* (under restoration).
1944 Morris C8 radio body (under restoration).
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  #23  
Old 09-03-14, 21:22
arie teomim arie teomim is offline
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ALL GOOD,
I took one of the rollers out. hope to put some pic soon. thanks you all. your tips were very helpfull.
arie
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  #24  
Old 11-03-14, 22:28
Hans Mulder Hans Mulder is offline
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I have a spare cross tube for anyone needing one, but shipping may be a challenge...
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