Work on My F8, No. 11

Jim Price · #1 15-06-08, 00:09

In the three days since the truck arrived, my friends and I have been able to:

Remove 8 of the 12 lug nuts from the rim that has a blown tire. (managed to only break the weld on one stud..... )

Removed both doors. The hinges required a bit of penetrating oil.. The rust rabbits have been at work on the bottom corners of both doors on the hinge side. However, the recent thread on door repair took care of any anxiety I had about fixing them back to normal....

Removed one of the two seats completely and one rail on the driver's side seat. By the way, most of the springs for the seats are present. Have contacted a local upholsterer for the resto job on them. I have one of the seat back covers to go by for material and plenty of pictures on what the finished product shold look like. A trip to a hardware store will take care of the missing springs!

Removed all but 8 bolts on the seam that separates the top from the lower back side of the cab as well as free up the bottom of the windshield. Couldn't figure out how to remove the fastenings (?) from the top and decided to have a closer look when the top was removed.

Straightened out one fender......for the most part..... Began taking the bolts off on the other one. Half way done with as many snapped off as taken out clean......

Started work this morning at 6 AM and worked until 11 AM as daytime temps are now above 100 degrees fahrenheit and will remain so for at least the next 4 months....

Have attached some pictures of the worst parts of the body where the rust rabbits have been having a banquet. Also, there's a picture of the engine compartment which shows some white stuff coming out of the sides which are next to the driver and the passenger. Is this asbestos? Also attached is a picture of the interior that shows a pale blue beneath the white top coat. Were the F8s' interior painted a different color that the exterior?

That's all for now!

Regards,
Jim

Bob Carriere · #2 15-06-08, 04:33

....nothing there a good body man could not fix in 15 minutes.....

Seriously..... you're on the right track...... take stock of what you have and what you need..... then the quest begin...... sad part is ..... it never ends.

Whatever you do....take time to enjoy it.... you have a rather unique vehicle .... parts do not grow on trees...... but you will be amazed at what you will find as many parts are interchangeable with Civvy Ford components..... half the fun is finding out which ones!!!!

Welcome to the asylum.

Boob

Bob Carriere · #3 15-06-08, 04:39

The inside of the engine compartment was insulated with a 1/4 inch soft asbestos panels ....... dispose of it carefully...... best bet is to spray it heavy with paint to cake the asbestos.....remove, bag it and dispose carefully..... a proper toxic dump center is not a bad idea.

What you have to be concerned with is the dust that may be released when you rip out whatever is left...... usually rodents have removed the better part for nesting material...... look for some mutant mouse with two heads around 20 pounds...... hihihi

Boob.

Jim Price · #4 15-06-08, 18:13

Bob:
Thanks for the kind words and the heads-up on the asbestos! Will proceed with all due care!

Regards,
Jim

maple_leaf_eh · #5 16-06-08, 04:22

The good thing about the asbestos is that it was mined in Quebec, and the industry thought it was doing the right thing for progress. There are at least two mineral compositions that get lumped together (edited - and are collectively known as asbestos). One is worse than the other.

Here's my free internet advice on the h-a-z-m-a-t removal. The danger is not the big chunks, but the loose airborne dust and fibre. There are all sorts of workplace health and safety rules about workers involved in the task, and then to dispose of it afterwards. After watching Norm Abrams and This Old House, I know the New England states have very tough rules about what can and cannot be done. Look around your state's regulations to find out how to do this job within the law.

Jim Price · #6 19-06-08, 00:15

Well, it's Day 8 (I'm counting from the day the truck arrived.) and the following has been accomplished: (in spite of over 105 degree Fahrenheit for each of those days which has limited working time to 4 hours each morning!)

The front fenders have been removed.
The doors have been removed.
(All the sheet metal forming the outside skin on the front of the cab was removed when I received the truck)
All the bolts that hold the bottom have of the back of the cab have beem removed.
All the bolts (except one) that hold the top and the back half together have been removed.
The windshield wiper motors (which I believe will work when cleaned up) were removed.
After 8 days the remaining 2 nuts of the twelve that hold the two halves of the split rim together were freed. Replacement of the tire blown during shipping can proceed.
The windshield top and bottom brackets were loosened.
The inside top panel above the steering wheel column was removed along with a Chevrolet heater. Have attached pictures of that little gem.

Have not removed the body parts as I am hoping for a visit from my body person who lives nearby. I wanted him to see all before we completed this step. All in all, with the help of some friends things are moving along quite nicely!

I do have a deadline to get everything stripped off the frame as the agreement with my neighbor to keep my Kubel in his garage was for 30 days only (set firmly in cement by his wife....) I've got 22 days to go and all is looking good!

More to follow!

Regards,
Jim

Jim Price · #7 19-06-08, 22:05

Temerature over 110 F today. All the metal is hot, hot, hot to the touch. Almost tried that technique shown in that German news clip from Afrika to fry an egg......(didn't have the requisite Panzer to use though.....)

Work proceeded with the following accomplished:

Removed the top panel covering the passenger (left) side of the cab. (Picture of front end attached.)

Removed the instrument cluster. All the plates are present and in fairly good, readable condition. All the switches are frozen, though. (Picture attached.)

Removed the horn.

Installed a tire and rim on the driver's side to see if I really need to replaced the bushings and king pin immediately. Wobble seems to be related to the wheel bearing.

The one stud that was broken when trying to remove its nut from the split rim will be welded tomorrow. This will enable to intall the tire and roll the vehicle around. Needed to get that done so we could remove the bed.

More to come!

Jim Price · #8 22-06-08, 17:53

Took Day 10 off to do errands: grocery shopping, haircut, and buy tools.
Day 11 and today, removed more internal body panels, the tail gate (which still has that little folding step on the inside) the windshield, roof and back bottom half of the cab.

Rewelded the stud on the split rim and reinstalled the tire and wheel back on the truck. Rubber on all four for the first time in 11 days!

Rechecked the king pins and definitely will need new bushings and more than likely, king pins as well.

Rounded up some sleepy neighbors at 7:00 AM this morning to push the truck out of the garage and turn it around so that the bed is facing the driveway. Am going to pull off the bed onto my trailer so that we can disassemble it.
Found another picture on the forum of a bed similar to mine (see picture.) I believe that mine must have originally had a wireless bed.

It's forecast to be 114 F today so have quit for the day!

Regards,
Jim

cletrac (RIP) · #9 22-06-08, 19:44

Jim, those beds are the 1A1 or 1A2 that have been lengthened by someone. You'll have to get it back to its original length and make up a set of lockers between the box and the cab. I can send you a cd with all the dimensions if you want. It looks like you've got the original front piece there too.
You can tell if your truck is a wireless version by looking under the hood. The wireless ones had copper grounding straps joining every body panel to help reduce static interference. They also used a shielded power wire to the coil for the same reason.

Jim Price · #10 22-06-08, 20:18

David:
That CD covering the lockers would be much appreciated. Email me and I'll send you my address. If there's any cost advise and I'll remind same.

By the way, how were the lockers affixed to the frame. And, how many gas tanks were there? The one I have seems rather short. Also, from what I can tell there might have been some sort of a wood platform on the Fords for all that that was placed right behind the cab. If that's so, where can I find the specs? And, where can I find the spare tire holder or plans for one?

Regards,
Jim
PS Checked on those copper grounding straps and none are present.

Jim Price · #11 25-06-08, 02:39

Yesterday we finally got all four bolts holding the bed to the frame off. Today we pulled it off onto my trailer for some stripping of panels. Got the rear ones off and called it quits at noon. The temp was 112 F by then and the three of us were whipped!

Found that an 8" section of channel was added to the rear to help support the extended bed. Also, a double set of rear springs are present to help out as well.

Noted that the frame has a diagonal repair made to it in the same exact location on both sides!?!? A piece of channel that perfectly fits the inside of the frame has been added to strengthen the repair (?). Almost looks like a factory job.

Have attached pictures of the above.

Regards,
Jim

cletrac (RIP) · #12 25-06-08, 03:44

Jim, all the F8s have that splice in the frame. That's the way Ford made them.

Jim Price · #13 28-06-08, 21:15

Since Day 14 we've:

Unbolted the drive shaft at the joints. (The shaft is bent and the ends will need to be rewelded to a new section of pipe.)

Removed the transmission (Although the motor was gone the tranny was still in place!). This was no easy task as the cotter pins holding the linkage together were rusted in place. Finally had to cut one rod in half to get it out.

Unbolted the floor from the frame.

Used a torch to cut off the extension off of the back end of the truck frame as well as cut the front bed panel off of the bed extension.

Measured all parts of the original bed.

Loaded up the the old bed and took it to the scrap yeard. (It's condition was such that it could not be reused.) Got $43 USD out of it!

Took the doors, back bottom panel and roof/rear window section to the media blaster for stripping.

Talked to the body shop next door to the blaster about fabricating replacement panels where needed for all the above parts. (I get the quote back next week.)

Went to the metal fabricator with all the measurements on the truck bed to get a quote for replacing the floor and seat panel sections as well as a new tailgate. (I get the quote back on this work in a couple of weeks.) We're going to reuse the original front and end panels as well as fabricate our own floor support beams then reassemble the bed parts ourselves.

Daytime temperatures are still exceeding 110 F so am taking today, Day 18, off!

Rookie · #14 29-06-08, 02:14

Go for it Jim. had the asbestos problem myself, take great care. To repeat, welcome to the assylum (too cold here at the moment to work on my truck in the barn)

Regards

Rookie

Mike Kelly · #15 29-06-08, 10:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jim Price

Loaded up the the old bed and took it to the scrap yeard. (It's condition was such that it could not be reused.) Got $43 USD out of it!

Jim,

I may have misunderstood your post. It's just my humble opinion, and I am probably out of line, but I would have kept the original 1A1 bed ( no matter what condition it was in ) until the new replica copy was made .. Even then I would have kept it for future reference . You really need the original on hand to look at the details like weld locations and other intricate stuff. There were variations with those bodies, they are not all the same . I made up a replica 1A1 tub and I wish I had an original on hand to look at . I only had photographs and drawings to go by and it was often a guessing game as to what is correct. Parts like tailgates are as rare as hens teeth .... I have a set of drawings compiled over 4 years. David P has filled in many gaps for me .

Mike

peter simundson · #16 29-06-08, 15:57

...that box would be "in the bushes" for a long time. Likewise all the parts I removed from the frame. It's amazing how years later what was thought to be a wood box support turns out to be the original spare tire spacer or wireless box mount.''

Peter S ('member me?)

PS You have a copy of Blueprint for Victory...right?

Jim Price · #17 29-06-08, 23:35

Mike and Peter:
Thanks for your comments! How right you both are as far as saving everything, either for future reference or recycling into the restoration! I did save the tailgate but the original bed had many, many pictures and measurements taken of it before considering taking it to the scrapyard. I hasten to assure both of you that all the bed parts were beyond use. I have on the other hand saved eveything else, nuts, bolts, brackets, you name it!

Regards,
Jim
PS Peter, yes I do remember you and no, I don't have a copy of Blueprint for Victory but will look for one. Thanks for all your past help!

Jim Price · #18 30-06-08, 00:24

Being a Sunday work was limited. Today we accomplished the following:

Removed the floor and the interior engine compartment walls.

Removed the master cylinder and all brake lines.

Removed the drive shaft.

Removed the starter solenoid and cable.

Took pictures before and after work that was done.

Am missing the driver's side floor support. Any ideas where I can find one? (See the picture.)

Noticed that the wood spacers that separate the floor from the frame end at the rear of the cab floor. However, because they are groved on the end I suspect they run back farther underneath the bed and possibly with another two short pieces placed on the frame ends right at the back end. Can somebody help educate me on that? (See the picture.)

Started at 7 am and quit at 11 am. Too hot!

Regards,
Jim

Jim Price · #19 01-07-08, 21:29

Yesterday and today we disassembled the front suspension. That involved:

Removed the hubs and bearings.

Removed the steering wheel, column and gear box.

Removed the steering arm and the connecting rod. (Had to use a puller on the steering arm!)

Removed the king pin retaining pins.

Removed the front axle.

What we didn't get done was removing the king pins. Those are stuck, stuck, stuck in the axle. Tomorrow will take the axle with spindles attached to a machine shop for removal. Will have them replace the king pins and bushings as well.

Am also stopping at a parts place and pick up all the parts needed to rebuild the brakes.

By the way, I'm missing the floor support bracket that's under the door on the driver's side; anybody out there have a spare one? (See the picture of the one I have.) I did contact Brian Asbury but he doesn't have it.

Hot again today (107 F) so we quit at 11 am.

Happy Canada Day!

Regards,
Jim

Jim Price · #20 04-07-08, 01:41

Today we concentrated on removing the front springs and the rear brakes, incuding the removal of the backing plates.

The front springs' shackle bolts, which are enclosed in the bushings, were worn to the extent that they as well as the brackets that hold the springs to the frame will need to be replaced. The front bracket which should have a simple slot looks like a keyhole!

We were unsuccessful yesterday in finding brake parts and are going to a brake specialty shop on Monday to see what they might be able to do for us.

Was surprised to find (and dismayed!) that the only brake part on the left rear side was the wheel cylinder. That's right! No shoes, no springs, no adjuster! Weird!

As for the right side, the entire brake system will filled with an oily gunk!

Have attached pictures of these two.

Got a call from the machine shop and the axle is ready. It took 18 tons of pressure to push out the king pins but now I have new bushings and pins! Will pick it up on Monday as well.

Temp reached 107 F so we stopped work at 1:30 pm today.

Regards,
Jim

Jim Price · #21 10-07-08, 03:16

Took the holiday weekend off, it being our Independence Day on July 4....

Resumed work on the truck on Monday, Day 27:

Picked up the front axle with the new bushings installed and new king pins

Dropped off a set each of all the front and rear brakes at the brake shop for them to match up with some of their old stock. (They've been in business for some 50+ years and felt confident that they could supply the needed parts.)

Had to saw through the front pins on the rear springs as they were completely rusted stuck! Used a portable band saw and it cut though the pins like a table knife through butter!

Located a spring shop nearby who will re-arch the springs as necessary. Got a surprise when talking with the owner; he's from the Chicago area and his dad and he used to work on CMP trucks that had been sold to US citizens. He identified my truck as a F8 just from my description of it!

Called the stripper (bead-, sand-blaster

) today and am dropping off the frame on Monday to be stripped

Called the body shop and arranged for them to paint the frame (Too convenient, they're next door to the stripper.)

Cut the material to make a floor support for the right side. Will post pictures when we've got the welding done.)

Did some grinding on the frame to remove the welds where the addition to the rear frame had been added to accomodate the extended bed

Quit early today; had to go to hospital early Tuesday morning with kidney stones. Was there for several hours and then sent home with a bunch of prescriptions. Am ok but am heeding the wake up call to drink more water in the 105+ F temps we're having!

Regards,
Jim

Alex van de Wetering · #22 10-07-08, 18:32

Jim,

Sadly I haven't had the time yet to fully answer the questions from your email, but attached you will find some pictures of the petrol tank-frame on my C8 as a start.

Alex

Jim Price · #23 11-07-08, 02:27

Alex:
Thank you for the pictures! I now know the thickness of the material, 1/8 ", as well as the shape of each of the two pieces. All I need now are the length of each and the three measurements related to the three sides of the bends in the rails, bottom width, heighth, and top width.

Regards,
Jim

cletrac (RIP) · #24 11-07-08, 03:05

Jim, the Fords didn't use that setup for the fuel tank mounts. They had a piece of about 2" plank that the tanks sat on. You can see it in this pic. I don't know the measurements though.

Mike Kelly · #25 11-07-08, 14:06

Jim

I believe David is correct. Don't get confused , the F8 tank mounts were different to the C8 setup. You can see that the top boards are different too, the C8 has a flush faced join where the top boards sit on the outside supports, the F8 top boards sit out slightly , by about 1" or more .

There are variations in the tool locker lids and details also. I dont know the whole stroy, but the bodies did change somewhat over the May 1940 to end of 1A1/2 production. I wonder if Beath made them all. Or did other companies build them ?

Mike

Alex van de Wetering · #26 11-07-08, 14:25

Good point David. I never realised the Ford and Chev fuel tank mountings were different. Even though the C8 seemed to have used fuel tanks with a Ford partnumber, judging from the parts list.

I would also be very interested in the CD with measurements, if possible. There will no doubt be a moment in the future when I need to fabricate the lockers and parts of the short box on my C8.

Alex

Jim Price · #27 11-07-08, 18:33

Thanks all from preventing me from making a blunder on the tank supports! Like Alex, I didn't realize that there was a difference. I could see from the pictures of the Ford factory images that a plank was used but thought that it might be supported by a pair of steel rails. I believe that I can use the tank I have to determine the width of the top two planks as well as the bottom one. As for length, I'll have to guage that by the pictures. It appears that the top two planks rest on a wood support that keeps them off the top surface of the tanks. By the way, what kind of wood was used, oak, ash?

This brings me to another pair of needs. I still need a set of drawings/plans which contain the measurements of the tool box as well as the spare tire frame and securing hardware. Help on these two will be most appreciated!

Regards,
Jim

cletrac (RIP) · #28 11-07-08, 20:17

The differences in the fuel tank mounts are a Ford-Chev thing since the tanks had to be mounted before the truck could leave the factory. Any differences in the box and lockers would be a different matter and could be found on Fords or Chevs.
Alex and Jim, I'll burn some CDs with that stuff on them and send them to you.

Jim Price · #29 12-07-08, 03:53

David:
Thanks for the offer to burn the CD with the specs on the box and lockers! Will look forward to receiving it. Having it will be a big help!

Regards,
Jim

Jim Price · #30 15-07-08, 01:29

Loaded up my Toyota with the springs and delivered them to a spring shop on Day 31.

Also went to the hardware store for a few bolts. Will probably be buying the majority of the remainder needed in bulk. Price each is considerable!

Went to the custom paint store to place an order for the paint. Picked up the paint on Day 32 and primed and painted a bit of the frame to see the effect. Didn't like it and took it back today to have it darkened, asking for forgiveness. Had the frame with me so could show them an old patch of painted area that had survived intact. It should be ready tomorrow.

The first thing today we installed the replacement for the right side floor support. Bob, my welder friend did a super job on it! Have attached pictures of the original on the left side and the new right replacement.

Today we took the frame to the stripper and stopped by the body shop to talk with the owner.

Advised him that I'd be delivering the paint tomorrow.

Having not heard from the spring shop, stopped by today and the owner advised that he didn't want to work on them so picked them up and called another when I got home. Will deliver them to the other shop tomorrow.

Came home, ate lunch (some great Mexican burritos) and then proceeded to take apart the split rims to dismount the four tires. Had sprayed the nuts with liquid wrench several times over the past couple of weeks all but one nut could not resist the air-driven impact wrench. Used a long bar and socket and removed that last one successfully.

Having started at 8:30 am and it being 2:30 pm, we stopped for the day.

It's now what we call the "monsoon" season here in Arizona and the rains have finally come. The humidity is such that one could dive off the curb and swim across the street!

Have freed my pet frog to swim in the pools of water in the back yard. He did great, having profitted by the dry season training I'd provided him with the quart jar of water I kept to put him into periodically so he could practice his swimming......

Regards,
Jim