Iltis Body Rotisserie

Stuart Fedak · #1 09-02-10, 03:14

Post no longer valid text removed.

Bob Carriere · #2 10-02-10, 04:22

.....fabricating, welding, etc.... let us know....

Boob

Bob Carriere · #3 10-02-10, 22:36

Gord.... if the Gods are not so kind next time and the balance is off..... consider adding a large counter weight similar to the pan box brake..... shop around for old weight lifting cast iron disc at flea markets or make your own in concrete........ old tractor weights would also be practical and flexible to adjust...... bet you got some of those around....

Now if you had learned how to weld up side down...lying on your back you .. would not have needed the BBQ device.....hihihi

I am considering building one when I will rebuild my cargo box..... but will need to instal a high lift bottle jack (all ready have one) at each end to adjust for height ...raise...spin around...lower to work on...raise spin around....etc.... brush with BBQ sauce.....

Boob

Gordon Yeo · #4 11-02-10, 02:40

Bob

I had made the ends of the carriage frame with the two pieces of 2X2 extra long with the thought that I might need weight for counter balanceing the body. The design incorperated the worst case scenario, I have access to lots of tractor weights and they would have been easy too attach.

I might have the MGB down on its wheels this summer and that rotisserie might work to hold a cargo box. That frame is on wheels, which would be nice.

Gord

Bob Carriere · #5 11-02-10, 03:58

... your rotisserie may be available during the farming season....?

short of being lucky..... have you found a practical way of fining the center of gravity for a body or cargo box.....

.... I had though of balancing the cargo box... lenght wise on a 2x2 tubing and drawing a vertical center line on the box head piece of the box....

Than standing it on its side and repeat the process....... where the two lines intersect should be a C.G.... I think..? so the head piece would have two lines crossing..... might have to add a piece of sheet metal at the tailgate....

Boob

PS.... 3 ton high rise bottle jacks are on sale at PA next week.....hihihi

maple_leaf_eh · #6 12-02-10, 04:29

If the rotisserie is on a hay wagon, how do you start the fire?

Clever idea. It makes me think about my Jeep underside more and more. You've done a bad thing to my subconscious.

Grant Bowker · #7 12-02-10, 23:05

Keep in mind that the hydraulic jacks are single acting, in other words they push beautifully but do a poor job resisting being pulled.
For the turning mechanism you might want to look at a worm gear. Worm gears have a quite high reduction ratio and don't generally drive back from the load, only from the input to the worm. Of course, if the load is perfectly balanced it should only need enough force to overcome the friction in the support........

Gordon Yeo · #8 13-02-10, 00:04

One purpose built rotisserie I saw on the internet was the pinnacle of engineering and is what got me started on wanting one. It was for the M151 MUTT and was probably designed for the military. It would mount the whole vehicle, complete with wheels. It has a worm gear with hand crank to rotate the vehicle 360 degrees and had a full base frame with castor wheels. The ends had a series of mounting points to allow the centre of gravity too be relocated as the weight of the mounted vehicle varied. That was a rotisserie!
I had a silo unloader winch that I was thinking of using for the rotating mechanism. I opted for simple and managed to guess close enough to the centre balance point that was quite manageable.
Bob, I would think that you should be able reason out where a box would balance. It's just basic physics. Put half the steel on top and half on the bottom. I know that sounds glib, but just sit and look at what you want mounted. Take your time, consult with your engineering team, and it will probably be close.

Gord

Bob Carriere · #9 13-02-10, 03:31

Vertical bottle jack are single action much like a regular jack...... by playing carefully with the release valve one should be able to lower the assembly safely...... but to be safe I would drill holes through the vertical tubing and insert a 5/8 standard hitch pin..... at worst it would only fall to the next hole/pin.... spaced every 4 to 6 inches.....

The whole idea of the vertical jack is to lift a wide assembly so it can turn 180 degrees and not touch the bottom rail(s).... and then lowered to a suitable working level......

My preference would be a worm drive......(mix and match between an auto tranny ring gear and a trailer winch worm) .... dual bottom rail... mounted on inflatable tires to negotiate loose ground around the barn.... home made screw jacks on all 4 corners to take weight off tires and keep it steady...

.... and painted OD.

I think I have some small surplus reduction gear box....offset 90 degrees..... 20 to 1 ..? not sure if they are worm drive... will need to search the barn....

Then after Grant finds them and hides them again....he will ask me how much is it worth to tell me were it is......

Stuart... I usually get dreams/visions of what is coming up for sale at PA..... and while at it why just make one..... taking orders.... would you like fries with that sir!!!!

Boob

Paul Singleton · #10 13-02-10, 04:26

If you are not planning on doing a lot of restorations you could probably do this type.

maple_leaf_eh · #11 14-02-10, 01:30

You'd need some pretty tall stools to sit around that picnic table.

Stuart Fedak · #12 14-02-10, 02:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by maple_leaf_eh

You'd need some pretty tall stools to sit around that picnic table.

Actually, that is just the sort of thing BooB uses for feeding the folks at his CMP BBQ. Of course it usually is the body of a HUP.......

Between the CMP; newer MIL vehicles; 6 pounders from the S&P museum; bonfires; bren carrier rides; BOOB's BBQ is the main event in the Ottawa Valley.

Cheers!
Stuart

Bob Carriere · #13 14-02-10, 15:44

....better show up.....

Boob

Bob Carriere · #14 17-02-10, 23:08

Hi Stuart

Let consider getting together to draw a draft design first.....

You steel stock maybe cheaper if you purchase full lenghts...... 20 or 22 feet and cut to size based on design plans... I have the dry cut off wheel... mig welder and covered place to work........

Design will reflect actual dimensions of your jacks......

Prefab sprocket will give good flexibility....

Have you looked at the worm drive of certain HD boat trailer winches at PA....?

Consider using a rear axle hub bearings instead of dry pipes for turning/support points..... one of the models you referred to has that feature.

Wheels should be selected with regards to the ground surface.... the roughest surface will need larger casters...also overall weight....

I usually make use of Valdais fabrication off Innes in town.....but only for when I need some precision bending on his large press.....

For basic stock I believe Bourdeau Steel just outside Embrun near Vars is hard to beat pricewise...... he deals with farmer who build thier own stuff and can give sound advice...free !!!! I can pick up full lenght with my trailer..... it is usually cheaper to cut your own as they have to charge the handling time to someone...... but that is your call.

If you were considering modifying the shop crane for the rotisserie you may be happy that you missed out and built your own....

Casters of various sizes will be available on a rotational basis this Spring at PA.... again size to be discussed.... and also caution on the caster wheels... some are nice... but if left outside in the WInter.... solid steel is better btu larger ones are more expensive.......freezing water will shatter the rubber/plastic tires on the casters..... ask how I know.....

Have rough idea of what HxWxL you will need.... and we can chat..... I will bring a flip chart....

BooB

Bob Carriere · #15 18-02-10, 02:55

Using a front axle disc brake hub...... genius..... strong.... readily available in scrap yard.....

I like the idea on Gord's BBQ.... the vertical square tubing is drilled for a bolt/nut...... copy that with a jack to raise it to the next hole.... bolt in place and relieve pressure on jack....good safety measure.....

Let's keep looking for odd parts and new idea....

Anybody else wants to chim in and make suggestions now is the time.....

I am on a course all of next week but anytime towards the end of Feb start of March we need to squeeze some gray matter together and come up with a design.... that will dictate how much steel we need..... we may have to visit the steel shop to see what sizes and tickness are available and what size square tubing slips into what larger size...ID and OD.. for a proper tight fit.....

I favour designing mine with one set of small car wheels/tires at one end.... the other end with solid adjustable legs..... as I will move it like a trailer using the farm tractor.... also allows me to go over rough ground to store in the back field...... could have removable wheels if they get in the way.....jack it up install wheel and tow it away.

.... and this way for the BBQ I can pull it to the back field and BBQ a whole steer !!!!!

Hang in there... keep thinking.

Boob

Gordon Yeo · #16 18-02-10, 03:13

If you guys want any more photos or measurements let me know. I am sure the unit is home built and uses 2X2 steel tubing for the frames. The sliders that make the collars to carry the crossmembers are one size larger dimention. It really is a simlpe design and drilling a few holes is the most complicated part of it.

Stuart Fedak · #17 18-02-10, 03:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gordon Yeo

If you guys want any more photos or measurements let me know. I am sure the unit is home built and uses 2X2 steel tubing for the frames. The sliders that make the collars to carry the crossmembers are one size larger dimention. It really is a simlpe design and drilling a few holes is the most complicated part of it.

Gord: Thanks for all the wonderful pictures and ideas. I think one the size you have, would work well for my needs for the Iltis. I will pehaps make it a bit bigger, for any future projects. Bobs needs are more heavy duty.

The use of the brake hub is wonderful. It is already robust and designed for the weight. Plus, should be readily available at a scrap yard. I was thinking of all the issues of using a pipe inside another pipe. It would need a collar at one end to keep the pipe from slipping out. Perhaps some grease fittings for keeping it lubricated, etc... a lot of design requirements... but it is already done.

I will have at least three Iltis body tubs to work on, so it will save lots of time. I have tried moving and flipping the Iltis body on my own, and it is too much weight. That is why I was so interested in this project.

Bob: The start of March is good. I have some weekend shifts at the hospital coming up, so not much time. This will be a good project, and will yield a useful product that I am sure will get shared around the Ottawa Valley.

Cheers!
Stuart

maple_leaf_eh · #18 18-02-10, 04:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stuart Fedak

BoB: I think Princess Auto must send you a personal notice of all upcoming sales

...

Cheers!
Stuart

Anyone can sign up for their sale catalogues and get three or four days jump on the rest of the crowd.

Bob Carriere · #19 08-02-11, 03:57

Hi Stuart

Already have the 2 jacks..... earlier model with hand pumps.

For the hub best bet is a single trailer hub from PA for one end.... the other end.... the end that makes it turn is best set up with a worm drive reduction gear box that can be driven by hand or with an impact wrench... they are about $175 new at PA or cheaper if you can find them at a flea market ... the larger the better and the slower the gear ratio the better....

We need to have a session in the barn to finalize the design... with some scrap steel and a flip chart to sketch our ideas.... the rest is just cut and welding.

I favor two independent end units... the driven one as a stand alone so it can be used for smaller parts.... and adjustable square tubing to adjust for length.

when is a good time...?

Bob

chris vickery · #20 08-02-11, 13:24

Stuart,
Two cheap engine stands, some extra box tubing to extend the satnce of the satnds legs, reposition the wheels, add whatever height you need to the stand with box tubing and make up a mount for each end to accomodate your iltis. Use a piece of electrical conduit to join both stand together at the right length and a couple bolts welded in to clamp the conduit in place. Cheapest easiest rotisserie to make, have done a couple. Probably less than $200