Canadian Chevrolet Maple Leaf 4x4 artillery tractors?

[Stellan Bojerud (RIP)]

10th May 1941 in Soerabaja. Parade on occasion of 1 year after German invasion of the Netherlands. 2nd Anti-Aircraft Bn (A II Ld) from Darmo barracks in Soerabaja.

Four 105 mm L/44 Bofors AA-guns M/1931. These four were the only such guns in the world. Ordered 1931, delivered 1932 and operational as an AA Bty in 1933. In 1942 these guns defended Perak Airfield.

In 1936 the KNIL changed to 80 mm AA-guns.

The parade is coming down Toendjangan-street. The street with the tram is Embong Malang.

[Stellan Bojerud (RIP)]

This picture is from 1938. Engineers Bn Tjimahi. The KNIL Signals belonged to the Engineers.

This is a truck with a trailer (hidden behind the personell) used for building telephone lines?

What type of truck?

The bodies of the trucks were made locally by the Transport Service workshops in Bandoeng. There were also depots in Batavia, Magelang, Soerabaja and Malang.

[David_Hayward (RIP)]

1928 Chevrolet Capitol Series Utility Express Model LO or LP? Note front brakes and artillery wheels.

[Hanno Spoelstra]

Originally posted by Stellan Bojerud
A new attempt to send pictures. It did work!

Congratulations! And what a wonderful pictures you are posting, I have never seen them before. Each time I read one of your threads I feel like having opened a can of worms. I can't keep up with you!

Couldn´t we find somebody skillful enough to make a KNIL homepage? I do next to nothing about computers.

I'd be very glad to help! If you provide the information and pictures, I will turn it into html and publish it on the web.

Keep up the good work!
Hanno

[Stellan Bojerud (RIP)]

Dear Hanno,

I have been waiting for my saviour so many years. On 9 Feb 1974 I met my "Java Tiger" (For respect a Tiger is allways written with a capital T and adressed as "Tuan Harimau = Mr Tiger or "Nona Harimau" = Mrs Tiger, if the sex is known).

Anyhow my "Tiger" is an "Anak KNIL" - a daughter of the KNIL.
Granpa SMA did in 1906 (then in Inf VI, later Inf XV) arrest relatives of her gran-granpa (The Radja of Boni). Fater SMI (Inf VII) murdered by the Japanese on Tarakan in 1942 + (so far) another four relatives died in WW 2. (Research ongoing - so far only one KiA, the others died unarmed in the hands of the Japanese).

Anyhow since 1974 I have been collecting facts about the KNIL. I got personal friends with a o Col Heshusius (who I provided with a number of pictures - and who provided me with a lot of documents) the late LtCol Kroesen and AOOI Piet van Meel (Editor of "Stabelan" magazine).

The US 2nd Bn/131 Field Arty is called "the lost Bn".I would call the KNIL the lost Army.

I would like to preserve the memory of the KNIL lost in 1950. All information I can supply will be provided.

Tonight is a happy evening. If I hadn´t already visited our local pub, I should go there to celebrate the "Return of the KNIL", but I have to be pleased with my fridge.

Enclosed please find how the KNIL managed to improve speed for the 75 mm L/30 Krupp M/1911-33 from 30 to 60 km/h.

Cordially,

Stellan

[Bill Murray]

Stellan:

I have high hopes that you and Hanno/Nuyt can start a very interesting site regarding NEI vehicle history.

However, it may be an idea to keep going on this board as I have the sense that there are many CMP enthusiasts that are interested in NEI stuff as a side issue to the whole history of Canadian/US vehicles in WWII and beyond.

Regarding your post NEI staff car, this can be an interesting small puzzle. The car is from the Chrysler family, no doubot of that.
However, Chrysler, just as GM and Ford, badged many of their cars differently for export markets. The vehicle appears to me to be a 7 passenger car, not a limousine with divider window, and could have been badged as a Dodge/Chrysler/Desoto or even a Plymouth.

In any case for tonight as I have to leave at O dark thirty tomorrow for my trip, let us at least agree it is a Chrysler product.
Bill

[nuyt]

Couldn´t we find somebody skillful enough to make a KNIL homepage?

I was just thinking the same, Stellan!

When I am back from holiday could we discuss this offline? with Hanno and other interested?

lets make it together!

Hasta luego,
Nuyt

[nuyt]

The picture of the Art. parade with the horseback staff watching is interesting:
I think it shows the Morris-Commercial artillery tractors (to be superseded by the GMC´s) AND GMC´s munitions trucks simultaneously.
It must be around the time the GMC´s were introduced, but not fully incorporated.
The next picture is a GMC bodied as ammo truck, I think. Next to it is a Chevrolet staff car of the earlier typ (late 20´s and similar to the Signal Corps truck), but still going strong during and after WW2 (see my other posting-Chevrolet ID help needed).
There´s also a picture (I will look it up bavk home) that shows the heavy AA guns towed by other trucks, possibly the GMCs.
Greetings
Nuyt

[Stellan Bojerud (RIP)]

Originally posted by ericnuyt
I think the NEI bought a large number of civilian chevrolet 1 1/2 tons 4x2 for public service and military post-45.
From Australia, possibly?

Hmm?

Looking to the picture posted by Nuyt 5 April 2004 I think:

If I remember right BK was registration for Soerakarta. And the reg nrs look like the pre WW 2 type.

CORRECTION: No, No, No, Soerakarta reg letter was AD not BK. I dont know the location of BK - but still I think this is a pre-WW 2 registration.

Stellan

[Stellan Bojerud (RIP)]

Originally posted by ericnuyt
The picture of the Art. parade with the horseback staff watching is interesting:
I think it shows the Morris-Commercial artillery tractors (to be superseded by the GMC´s) AND GMC´s munitions trucks simultaneously.

I agree. The gun tractors were probably bought at the same time as the 105 mm howitzers and that was in 1924-25. The ammo trucks are younger.

So it should be sometime in the early 1930-ies.

[Stellan Bojerud (RIP)]

Originally posted by ericnuyt

I think it shows the Morris-Commercial artillery tractors (to be superseded by the GMC´s) AND GMC´s munitions trucks simultaneously.

Nuyt

I found some other pictures of the 1st Howitzer Bn. It is stated that those pics are from 1931.

Stellan

[Stellan Bojerud (RIP)]

A clue?

[Stellan Bojerud (RIP)]

A Bty taking a brake on way to or from the firing ranges 1931.

Different types of trucks. What could they be?

[Stellan Bojerud (RIP)]

Originally posted by ericnuyt

There´s also a picture (I will look it up bavk home) that shows the heavy AA guns towed by other trucks, possibly the GMCs.

Nuyt

Is this the type you were thinking of? Beeing a soldier I don´t know so much about trucks, but I do know military units and tactics.

Anyhow here is D 10638 (D=Bandoeng) from 3rd Anti-Aircraft Bn (A III Ld, Bandoeng) towing an AA Searchlight. There are four searchlights in the column + trucks towing the electrical generators. I think they are on their way to or from the big parade at Andir AFB in April 1940 (?). On other occasions searchlights did not come in groups of four, but were deployed individually.

Greetings,
Stellan

[David_Hayward (RIP)]

The twin-wheeled truck looks like a 1940 Model Chevrolet chassis with flat-face cowl...the difference between '39 and '40 Models is opf course that the latter has the shallower top grille.

[Stellan Bojerud (RIP)]

Thank you David!

I Found another pic of 3rd AA Bn. Andir AFB April 1940. Reg numbers not readable.

Greetings

Stellan

[Stellan Bojerud (RIP)]

And here a few more towing 40 mm AA-guns L/60 Bofors M/1936.
The nearest truck is D 7217.

[Stellan Bojerud (RIP)]

The C-in-C of KNIL, General H.S. Spoor, died on 25th May 1949. Here is a picture from the Menteng Poeloe Military Cemetery.

A 25-pounder (87,6 mm) Mk II gun (ex-British) towed by an Arty truck 4 x 4.

Is the truck of the pre-WW 2 KNIL type?

[cliff]

not sure but it has the lines of a modified WC Dodge or power wagen.

[Hanno Spoelstra]

Originally posted by Stellan Bojerud
Is the truck of the pre-WW 2 KNIL type?

Stellan, this is a Dodge Power Wagon, the civilian reincarnation of the wartime WC-series. No doubt Gordon can provide model details.

Due to political pressure on the Netherlands to grant Indonesia its independence, the supply of military vehicles from abroad was curtailed. Therefore the post-war KNIL sourced quite a number of civilian vehicles - it is not uncommon to see vehicles with shiny paint and chrome!

H.

[Stellan Bojerud (RIP)]

Thank you Cliff!

Returning to the pictures I have posted during the last days but also the discussion about Ford/Marmon-Herrington MGTs 26th-28th Mrs 2004 (see that thread), I began thinking about registration numbers (so far only D=Bandoeng) as a means to establish the age of a vehicle.

D 7073 was an Opel P 4 mod 1935/36. In mid 1937 an Alvis-Straussler AC was D 7001. When the first VCL tanks arrived 9th Nov 1937 they got numbers D 7145, D 7152, D 7189 and D 7211. In 1939 the VCL tanks were D 9800-9824. In Apr 1940 a Vickers Utility Carrier got D 9947.

So this seems to be the pattern:
D 7000 1937
D 8000
D 9000
D 9800 1939
D 9900 1940

How about the Opel P 4 mod 1935/36 nr D 7073? I have seen such a car with registration letters AA, so I think it was transferred from Batavia and registred in Bandoeng in 1937.

The picture of an older truck D 7235 towing a 75 mm M/1911 gun I think shows one of those bought in 1924-25 for the 105 mm howitzers wich were replaced by GMCs. So I think this truck was transferred from Batavia to Bandoeng in 1937.

I beleive that this truck was used by the
Depot Mobilele Artillerie (DMA) in Tjimahi.

Finally the truck towing an AA searchlight is D 10838 which indicates 1941 or late 1940. But a similar truck towing 40 mm Bofors gun is D 7217 which should be about 1937-38.

So there are two possibilities: D 7217 is of an older model than D 10838 or D 72127 was a vacant number reused. Which model is D 7217?

Attached: Chevrolet 1940 "Autoletten" with 12,7 mm (.50) AAMGs M/1930 Colt-Browning reg nrs D 9966, D 9963 and D 9962.

Greetings,

Stellan

[David_Hayward (RIP)]

General Motors Java Handel Mij supplied the Opel, Chevrolet, GMC and Maple Leaf vehicles. Until I saw the photo of the Opel staff car circa 1940, I had no idea that GM Java had imported any Opels but this was part of the 1936-on push to export. I wonder if there were any Vauxhalls in the Netherlands East Indies?

[Stellan Bojerud (RIP)]

Originally posted by David_Hayward
Until I saw the photo of the Opel staff car circa 1940

Thank you David!

Where can I find that picture?

Stellan

[David_Hayward (RIP)]

Stellan,
http://www.mapleleafup.org/forums/sh...highlight=Opel

I have just been looking at official photos and saw that GM of Canada offered both the Chevrolet 1543 CC60L with twin rear wheels + 2-speed axle to the DND as well as the GMC 9543 equivalent, as Chassis with Windscreen albeit that the GMC photo is of the 1940 Model with variant of the Chev grille. Except that the GMC used the 30.2hp Pontiac 224 engine based on the Chev unit. The cowls have 'GENERAL MOTORS TRUCK' on the sides. The 4 x 4 versions would have the same engine, but the Chevrolet or Maple Leaf 4 x 4 chassis would have used the Chevrolet 216 unit. The non-standard nature of the 224 unit would have been a downside in the offering of an export truck..thus I think that although the tractors were GMC-based, they were 'Maple Leaf' badged as they had the ubiquitous 216 Chev engine which the KNIL would have been familiar with. I therefore retract my previous suggestions over badging although this may have been a consideration in the minds of the GM of Canada management.

[Stellan Bojerud (RIP)]

Thank You David!

Very interesting indeed. I enclose a picture of some Opel AA-cars. April 1940 Andir AFB outside of Bandoeng.

Units of APLA 2 (2nd Heavy Weapons Coy, 1st Inf Reg) AA Platoon. 12,7 mm (.50) AAMGs M/1930 Colt-Browning of which the KNIL had 140 extant in 1942.

Reg numbers: D 7085, D 7074 and D 7084.

Greetings

Stellan

[Stellan Bojerud (RIP)]

I came across another pic of a KNIL Commandowagen.

1937 Waterlooplein, Batavia (Jakarta).

[Stellan Bojerud (RIP)]

Originally posted by David_Hayward
1928 Chevrolet Capitol Series Utility Express Model LO or LP? Note front brakes and artillery wheels.

Same type of truck?

[David_Hayward (RIP)]

The lower photo looks to me like a 1927ish GMC bus.

[nuyt]

HI Stellan and David,

Some of these pictures were already discussed on this thread:

chevrolet ID help needed

Greetings
Nuyt

[Stellan Bojerud (RIP)]

Thank You!

That one I have missed.

Stellan