M4A2 Sherman III

[RWDiesel]

Originally Posted by kevinT

I am currently working on the Formations Models M4A2. ( lovely kit it is too ).
I am looking for Canadian / British units that used the Sherman III, in NWE preferably.
Any tank names, matching WD numbers would be a bonus.
Cheers
Kevin T

Maybe a bit late, but you might still be interested.
Got 3 Sherman III photo's of 2nd. Can. Armd. Brig. B squadron Fort Garry Horse, in the photo's are 2 Sherman III's and the photo's are taken from 3 different angles, WD numbers are T229994 and T229880.
The photo's are taken on Sunday 15 April 1945 on the crossing Rademarkt Zuiderdiep in Groningen.
Photo's are scanned from: "Vier Dagen in April" (4 Days in April) 1999 by MH Huizinga & B van Leusen ISBN 90-76457-05-0 and 32 Authentieke foto's van de bevrijding van Groningen (32 authentic photo's of the Groningen Liberation) 1970 N.V. Foresta Groningen.



Hope it's still helpfull, cheers Ronald.

[kevinT]

Hi Ronald,

Thank you for posting the photos.
Although I had both numbers listed you have actually clarified something for me. I originally had the numbers as CT numbers but it clear that the number is T not CT as many Canadian vehicles are prefixed. Perhaps they were relatively new tanks when the photo was first taken.
Please post anymore you have all are of interest.

Cheers
Kevin

[Roddy de Normann]

Originally Posted by Geoff Winnington-Ball

Kevin, the Sherman pictured above, "Bomb", was an M4A2 and one of the few Shermans of any marque to survive the war from D-Day through to the end of the war. It was brought back and is presently a plinth vehicle in Sherbrooke Quebec. You can't do better than that!

Geoff -

I am currently going through all the Canadian Armoured Regiment War Diaries - thanks to the International Landing Scheme that sends me the microfilmed papers. One thing I am picking up is the number of vehs that appeared to have been issued to a regiment in 1943/44 only to be handed in by the same regiment in June/July 1945. The oldest one I have found was issued for the Sicily campaign in 1943 and then handed in to B Sqn, 25 CADR in June 45. Once I have gone through the lot, I will post those I have found...

Roddy

[Roddy de Normann]

Hi to all -

Ref the Polish WD Nos used in the UK, I have only really noted these for vehs used by the Poles between 1940 to 1942. I have also noted - but can not for the life of remember where from - that vehs issued to other Occupied Nations - Dutch & Belgians for instance - also used the longer nos.

All those that I have noted to date are based on photo evidence - I have not seen any evidence from docs to date. Perhaps other members have ?

Either way, below are the nos I have seen and logged:

POLISH ARMOURED FORCES IN UK

T. 1283032 -

Valentine III - 1st (Polish) Armoured Division ? - 1941 - Exercise in Scotland ?

T. 1290231 -

Renault UE M1e Tractor - 67th (Polish) Tank Battalion & 3rd Bn, 1st Tank Regiment - Veh had '074' in box on fnt - 1940 ? - UK. Veh reportedly one of 17 vehs brought back fm France and used for trg - Veh pic in Lexicon of Armd Forces, Vol.1 & 'Od Acromy do Zwyciezcy - Vol 6'

T. 1290235 -

Renault UE M1e Tractor - 67th (Polish) Tank Battalion & Tk Sqn, Recce Battalion, 1st (Polish) Armoured Division Recce Bn later became 3 Tk Regt - Veh had '074' in box on fnt - Pic in Wydanictwo Militaria No.196 '1st Armoured Division 1939-1945' - Via Michael Grieve Archive

T. 1290249 -

Valentine I or II - 65th (Polish) Tank Battalion, 16th (Polish) Tank Brigade - 1942 - Scotland ? - Pic in Wydanictwo Militaria No.196 '1st Armoured Division 1939-1945' - Via Michael Grieve Archive

T. 1290251 -

Valentine I or II - 65th (Polish) Tank Battalion, 16th (Polish) Tank Brigade - 1942 - Scotland ? - Pic in Wydanictwo Militaria No.196 '1st Armoured Division 1939-1945' - Via Michael Grieve Archive

T. 1290270 -

Carrier Universal Mk.I - 1st (Polish) Corps - Summer 42 - UK - Pic in Wydanictwo Militaria No.196 '1st Armoured Division 1939-1945'

T. 1290295 -

Valentine I or II - 1st (Polish) Armoured Division - 21 Aug 41 - Scotland - IWM pic H 13003

T. 1290923 (?) -

Carrier Universal Mk.I - 14th (Polish) Regiment (Jaziovieckis Uhlans) - 1942 - Scotland ? - Pic in Wydanictwo Militaria No.196 '1st Armoured Division 1939-1945' - Via Michael Grieve Archive

T. 1292746 - 'PERS'

Carrier Universal Mk.I - 1st (Polish) Motorised Artillery Regiment - Date u/k - UK - Pic via 'Od Acromy do Zwyciezcy', Kaminski, Vol 9

T. 1292853 -

Valentine I or II - 24th (Polish) Lancers - 1942/43 - Scotland - Veh noted in pic used in 'Od Acromy do Zwyciezcy - Vol 8'

T. 1292858 -

Valentine I or II - C Sqn, 66 Tank Battalion & 2nd Tank Battalion, 16th (Polish) Armd Bde - '073' with 66 Tk Bn - Jan 43 - No on pic in Vanguard No.30 via Gwyn Evans & Lexicon of Armd Forces, Vol.1

T. 1292923 -

Carrier Universial - 2nd Rifle Bn, 10th (Polish) Cav Bde (later 14th Jazlowiecki Lancers) - 1940 ? - UK. Veh pic in 'Od Acromy do Zwyciezcy - Vol 6'

T. 1293000 -

Carrier Universial - 10th (Polish) Mounted Rifle Regiment, 1st (Polish) Armoured Division - Scotland - Veh noted in pic used in 'Od Acromy do Zwyciezcy - Vol 8'

T. 1293047 -

Churchill II - Poss 66th (Polish) Tank Battalion, 16th (Polish) Armd Bde - Date u/k - UK - Pic via 'Od Acromy do Zwyciezcy', Kaminski, Vol 9

T. 1293042 -

Churchill II - Prob 66th (Polish) Tank Battalion, 16th (Polish) Armd Bde - 1942 - Scotland - Pic in Wydanictwo Militaria No.196 '1st Armoured Division 1939-1945'

T. 1293048 -

Churchill II - Prob 66th (Polish) Tank Battalion, 16th (Polish) Armd Bde 1942 - Scotland ? - Pic in Wydanictwo Militaria No.196 '1st Armoured Division 1939-1945' - Via Michael Grieve Archive

T. 1293115 -

Carrier TCP - 1st (Polish) Armoured Division - Pic via Kaminski Archive, Vol 9

T. 1293172 -

Covenanter II - RHQ, 65th Tk Bn, 1st (Polish) Tank Regiment, 1st (Polish) Corps - 1942 - Scotland ? - Pic in Wydanictwo Militaria No.196 '1st Armoured Division 1939-1945' - Via Michael Grieve Archive - Also noted in 'Od Acromy do Zwyciezcy' , Vol 6

T. 1293176 - Covenanter II - 65th (Polish) Tank Battalion & HQ Sqn, 1st (Polish) Tank Regiment - Veh had '072' in box on fnt - 1941 - Scotland ? - Pic in Wydanictwo Militaria No.196 '1st Armoured Division 1939-1945' & Lexicon of Armd Forces, Vol.1

T. 1293177 -

Covenanter II - Not Known 1st (Polish) Tank Regiment, 1st (Polish) Corps - 1941 - Scotland - Pic in Wydanictwo Militaria No.196 '1st Armoured Division 1939-1945'

T. 1293178 -

Covenanter II - RHQ, 65th Tk Bn, 1st (Polish) Tank Regiment, 1st (Polish) Corps - 1941 - Scotland ? - Pic in Wydanictwo Militaria No.196 '1st Armoured Division 1939-1945' - Via Michael Grieve Archive

T. 1293200 -

Covenanter II - Poss Guards Armd Div & Armd School, 1st (Polish) Corps - 1940/41 ? - UK. Veh pic in 'Od Acromy do Zwyciezcy - Vol 6'

T. 1293246 -

Crusader II - RHQ, 1st (Polish) Tank Regiment - 1941/42 ? - Veh pic in 'Od Acromy do Zwyciezcy - Vol 7'

T. 1293249 -

Loyd Carrier - HQ Sqn, 10th (Polish) Mounted Rifle Regiment - '51' on mudguard - 1943/44 - Scotland - Veh noted in pic used in 'Od Acromy do Zwyciezcy - Vol 8'

T. 1293374 -

Covenanter II - RHQ, 65th Tk Bn & 1st (Polish) Tank Regiment, 1st (Polish) Corps - Veh had '072' in box on front 1941 - Scotland ? - Pic in Wydanictwo Militaria No.196 '1st Armoured Division 1939-1945' & also in 'Od Acromy do Zwyciezcy - Vol 7'

T. 1367288 - 'WYSOKIE'

Crusader III - 1 Tp, B Sqn, 1st (Polish) Armoured Regiment - Pic via 'Od Acromy do Zwyciezcy', Kaminski, Vol 9

T. 1367296 -

Crusader III - 1st (Polish) Armoured Regiment - 1942 - Chippenham, UK - Pic in Wydanictwo Militaria No.196 '1st Armoured Division 1939-1945' - Via Michael Grieve Archive

T. 2612884 -

Carrier - Polish Armed Forces - Info via MLU Forum

[Roddy de Normann]

Kevin -

As far as I can deduce, CT nos were only assigned to those vehs that were manufactured in Canada. Certainly all the tanks that were used by the Canadians (less Rams & Grizzlies) that were handed back into 25 CADR had T nos, not CT nos...

Roddy

[Bodston]

Originally Posted by Roddy1011

Hi to all -

Ref the Polish WD Nos used in the UK, I have only really noted these for vehs used by the Poles between 1940 to 1942. I have also noted - but can not for the life of remember where from - that vehs issued to other Occupied Nations - Dutch & Belgians for instance - also used the longer nos.

All those that I have noted to date are based on photo evidence - I have not seen any evidence from docs to date. Perhaps other members have ?

I have another one for you. An original photograph from my collection of a Polish Carrier T1290216. The photograph has been cropped but part of the type written inscription is still legible, "...Scotland after his return from the United States... During parade". The image is also extensively stamped on the reverse with variously "Republic of Poland Ministry of Information Foto Service", "Polish Army G.H.Q. Chief Censor", "34 NOT to be published" and the date "18 Jan 1943". There are also several stamps in Polish "Deleget weiskowy do sp..." and I think the photographers name and signature, "Boguslawski pplk. dypl. - Lt. Col."

Edit: More excellent Polish Tank photographs here

[kevinT]

Hi Bodston,

With the above, Roddys additions and a few other numbers I have some 60 odd 7 digit Polish and Belgian WD serials. I would certainly be interested in anymore you may have in your collection.
Do you know if these 7 digit numbers were issued to new vehicles or re-issued to older vehicles with 6 digit numbers.
Thanks again for posting.

Cheers
Kevin

[Roddy de Normann]

Many thanks for posting the Carrier pic and the links - they are good pics. Numbers now added to the listing !

Ref your pic, the name I think probably refers to the officer saluting in the carrier. He is likely to be the Commanding Officer (Lt Col)...so if you might be able to match his name to the unit. I'll give it a go.

Many thanks again,

Roddy

[Bodston]

Originally Posted by Roddy1011

Many thanks for posting the Carrier pic and the links - they are good pics. Numbers now added to the listing !

Ref your pic, the name I think probably refers to the officer saluting in the carrier. He is likely to be the Commanding Officer (Lt Col)...so if you might be able to match his name to the unit. I'll give it a go.

Many thanks again,

Roddy

You are right with that Roddy. The officer saluting is a Podpulkownik (pplk) equivalent to Lt. Col. (2 bars, 2 stars on the epelette)
They are wearing fibre rim parachutists helmets with paras kite insignia on their collar tabs. The tall man in the back seems to be wearing the early parachutists sleeveless oversmock too. This predates the issuing of the Denison smock. As there was only one Polish para unit this identifies them as part of 1st Polish Independent Parachute Brigade.
Whether the carrier belongs to them or they just hitched a lift I don't know.

[Bodston]

Originally Posted by kevinT

Hi Bodston,
I would certainly be interested in anymore you may have in your collection.
Do you know if these 7 digit numbers were issued to new vehicles or re-issued to older vehicles with 6 digit numbers.
Thanks again for posting.

Cheers
Kevin

I don't have anymore photos showing 7 digit WD numbers. Pity. As for the second question, I have no idea, sorry.