Panzer WW2 footage

[Bob Cohoon]

I just thought i would bring this to people`s attention.I found a very neat site which has some short tapes of various German tanks,noteably Panther, Tiger I and II,on some kind of testing area,maybe Aberdeen or ...? The tiger II Porsche turret footage is really good,and even shows it doing a pivot on its tracks.It shows how tough the transmission and tracks actually were,as this tank was 68 tons.This is the title: http://www.worldwar2aces.com/ww2-footage.htm

[Bob Cohoon]

Amazing what you can find at the beach,eh ? Seriously,when I visited the CFB Borden museum a couple of years ago, they were restoring a Hetzer also,and doing an excellent job.Maybe it may run also.Thanks for these threads, and looks like they did an excellent job of that classic Panzer III at the Patton Museum.

[sapper740]

Originally posted by enthusiastblue
I just thought i would bring this to people`s attention.I found a very neat site which has some short tapes of various German tanks,noteably Panther, Tiger I and II,on some kind of testing area,maybe Aberdeen or ...?

Wherever it is, that King Tiger won't be seeing combat anytime soon. Did you notice the end of the barrel?

[Bob Cohoon]

Yes,it must have had a barrel blockage, and this blew the muzzle brake and some of the barrel off. The barrels were changeable,though, as I read somewhere that the barrels were usually changed after 200 rounds or so on the German high velocity guns due to the abrasion of the projectiles.

The Tiger II in the video was one that came into British hands when they over ran the Porsche testing facility at Haustenbeck near Sennelager in 1945. The barrel damage was an expedient measure to render the vehicle un-serviceable by the Germans. This information comes from two books, one by P. Gudgin, the other by H. Doyle. Mention was also made of the Hetzer being restored at CFB Borden. Unfortunately, it is now all welded up and sitting outside with the other vehicles that should be stored indoors.

Perry

[Bob Cohoon]

Went to see CFB Borden about a week ago,and ,yes,the Hetzer is outside, painted over.There is some good news though,as the Staghound,Valentine, Matilda, Ram, and M13-40 tanks are now in a new building extension,along with other soft skin vehicles and a cut away T-62? I believe.Didn`t see the Panther tank, though,so maybe it`s being restored ,or maybe just moved.There is a Grizzly (Sherman) near the entrance gate,and M24 Chaffee and T-72 in parks along the way to the museum.The Churchill I is outside with a new coat of gloss paint,and a Leopard 2A4,I think, has been added as an outside exhibit.

There was once a plan to put all the vehicles at Worthington Park indoors (except for the two Stuarts either side of the Worthington Memorial). The powers that be then decided to tear down "surplus" buildings to save money on general maintenance heating them, this put an end to moving the vehicles into the two buildings that were to the north of the existing museum. It is nice to see however, that they have improved the museum that is still there. I was at Borden three weeks ago myself and noticed that they have spread the armoured vehicles all around the base, and I did not see the Panther either. I wonder how the group of volunteers that were working on the Hetzer feel, seeing it back outside in the elements.

Perry

[Robert Dabkowski]

... Perry.
The museum buildings (2) teardown wasn't quite as cold hearted as you suggest. Base Borden is a federal facility and as such doesn't pay property taxes to the Town of Angus but DOES use their piped water and some of their sewer services. As such Borden makes a yearly payment to the town in lieu of taxes.

That payment was based on the square footage of the enclosed building space (total) on the Base. Problem was that someone miscounted years ago and this fact was just recently (well, 4 years ago actually) discovered. In order to not have to make a back payment (of several years worth + interest) it was ordered (by DND HQ in Ottawa) that any and all old buildings possible be knocked down immediately to reduce the base's building square footage down to the level it was 'supposed' to be.

Thus mostly the wooden structures most contaminated (with asbestos and lead) and suffering the most dry rot and with the oldest heating systems (and thus the most expensive to renovate) were the ones to go ... 12 buildings in total afaik, only two from the museum.

And now that more money has been 'found' some three years later, they have started to renovate two of the original 1917 airplane hangers over on the flightline for new life as an aircraft museum. Not quite a 1to1 trade in square footage but at least original 3 tank hangers and two 1917 aircaft hangers will now be saved for history instead of 5 (very similar) tank hangers ...

Its not the perfect solution but I think that it will all work out ok in the end. At least better than most government efforts, anyway.

[Bob Cohoon]

Found out where the famous Panther is.Apparently it has been sent to Ottawa to be added to the new war museum, by the powers that be.It should impress the visitors to this museum for sure, although it will be missed by Camp Borden museum visitors and staff ,most likely.They have a nice collection there already.For those who haven`t seen it, there is a Mk. II panzer, panzerjeager IV, Sherman M4A4, M4A3E8,sturmgeschutz III (damaged from range fire on one side), M3 Lee,M5A1 Stuart,Valentine (recovered from Russian river),T34-85(mint operational, restored and presented to museum ),Churchill III,Churchill Ark, Leopard I,Chieftan MBT,M109 SPG,Russian BMP,T72,Staghound A/C, Fox A/C,Lynx A/C (Canadian Dingo),Otter A/C,Italian small tankette/SPG ,plus many guns,such as 88mm flak, Pak 40,Pak 38, 37mm ,37mm Guerlich taper bore,20mm flak,6 pounder,17 pounder,25 pounder,kettenkrad, schwimmwagon (all original) ,plus many more softskin vehicles.They also have a German 1 man submarine, a `Biber`I think.