The MV Hobby, De-Mob

[Ian Fawbert]

Hi all,

I'm 31. I started with my first jeep at 19, then a second at 20 and so on.

I guess I'm different in my interest though as my parents both met in the Sydney based Vintage Motor Club (celebrating its 60th anniversary just last week!). Dad with a 1928 Oldsmobile, Mum a 1930 straight 8 Nash, both cars still in the family and regularly rallied (well the Nash is getting an engine rebuild at be moment!). I first cottoned onto the idea of the lack of young people in clubs in my early teens- despite the VMC getting alot of cars on rallies and we went to a lot of rallies around NSW/the east coast too, my younger brother and I were often the youngest or only young ones on the rally!

Regardless, I have 'won'/been awarded youngest driver at the major rallies we attend each Easter for far too long. The last time I got it (2012) I stood up and asked the room (300 people much much my senior) how many had a child or even better grandchild over 16. Alot of hands went up. I then said that everyone with their hand up needs to let those kids drive their cars that at then 30, I was tired of getting and didn't want to be given youngest driver any more!

I think the fact of the matter is alot of kids have alot more on their mind. There is so much on offer to attract them in every direction and probably by the time they get to a point they might be able to show an interest (if not inspired by their parents/family/friends) alot are trying to afford a house of family and an old car, whatever the age is not high on the list or, for manyof the vehicles we have, an affordable option in todays market prices- 15-30k jeeps dosnt help them much! I'm just lucky that I was able to buy a jeep cheap enough and had parents with the space and encouragement to help me restore it. I think when prices drop which they will (look at the low true 1919-1930 vintage car prices in the 90's opposed to the higher prices of the 80's) as others have said, that will help more enter the hobby.

Not an easy one to solve and I also think we'll just need continued and varying approaches. The days of clubs (which cater for our vehicles and older) just sitting back and young members approaching the with or looking to buy a car are long gone I'd say. Plus, the old idea (maybe already eluded to above) that 'kids' of today will be interested in their parents era of cars doesn't help. All that said there are young guys and girls moving through the clubs I see around NSW- take a look at the Corowa swim in- there is an increasing younger group of people there! So, young people are getting involved, just not in the numbers many of us would like to see.

Curiously though, when I see pictures of rallies in Europe (admittedly MV ones) there are ALOT of young guys and girls driving vehicles, so there is an interest there somewhere. I wonder what European clubs or cultures have done which helps promote his, or am I just seeing a small group of people over and over relative to the technology I am viewing them on?

Cheers,
Ian.

[Gordon Yeo]

I have been to celebrations in Holland in 1995 as a spectator and as a participant in 2010. I think the reason there are young people interested in military vehicles is because they are immersed in the history of WW2. They also have such a huge concentration of running vehicles in such a small geographic area. Europe lived the privations of war and celebrated freedom. Canada went from economic depression to an economy of prosperity that provided jobs and demand for every commodity we could produce. Big difference between experiences.

[hrpearce]

I am in the most popular age group so far and will be there for two more years. Our motor club is going strong with members from 17 to early 90's.
The 17 year old is restoring a Bedford truck. Both my boys drive manuals and it only took Greg 12K's to master the blitz gearbox. Sam can't drive it until he gets his P's, the insurance doesn't cover L's.

[Phil Waterman]

Hi All

I've been watching the videos from Hanno's post XXX Corps event: Liberation Task Force | 13-22 September 2014, Holland and it gives me heart that the MV hobby is alive and well in some locations. The sheer numbers of vehicles and people that turned out and took part says that something. As does the age range of the people taking part.

The point that we need to keep trying to attract younger people into the hobby and love of these trucks is not lost though.

Here is one survey on the economic impact of the antique car hobby that you might find interesting http://www.historicvehicle.org/~/med...18%202011.ashx

Cheers Phil

[Niels V]

Well I am one of the really odd one's out.
I am 29, and have a rather large collection of UK/Can vehicles. (Though selling a couple now)
I got interested in MV because one of my fathers friends bought a C60L Cab 13, and took the time to drag me with him to shows and told the history of the vehicles and the war, let me help out with the work on it, and then bought my own Austin Champ at age 16
I have some friends in my age groupe that have vehicles, but one problem I think many young people have is storage space, we cant afford big houses or having to rent a barn for the vehicles, when we just have begun to earn money and maybe are starting a familiy.
And most of the small, easy to handel, vehicles (jeeps etc.) are fare to expensive for us.
the only reson that I can have the vehicles I do is that my father 10 years ago bought a farm because he wanted to live in the countryside, and I therefore dont have to think about storage cost. I dont think the hobby will die out, and specially if people take the time to tell the history of the vehicles and so on when at shows I think new people can be attracted, and the MV do attracked attension when I bring my Scammell to a car show, there is a constant flow of people wanting to talk with me about it.

[Hans Mulder]

It is great be part of a community like MLU - I think the sheer amount of information readily available worldwide will grow the hobby, including younger guys like myself. We do need to balance the mortgage, wife and kids' needs, etc, but I work overtime and run little schemes to finance the carrier, the '78 Camaro, the gun and militaria collection. One day, when I'm old and fat, I'll be the one the young guys starting in the hobbies point to and say "He's got one, and its near mint - how did he ever accumulate/restore that?"

[Phil Waterman]

Hi Stuart

My vote is for Mystical, "old fart" who has three fully running restored CMP stashed in the barn. Of course I take them out and drive them every chance I get.

But I take your point, probably all of use have watched over the years as a once restore-able truck, or antique what ever, gradually is reclaimed into the earth as rust. All the while the owner turns down every inquiry from somebody that might restore it, saying I plan to restore that.

But there is some validity to idea of storing that old truck/car away in the corner of the garage until you have the time and to money to restore it. I'm working one now that has been hidden away since 1973 or so, and there are two more inline after that one. But then apparently, I like others who love CMPs are exceptions that prove the rule.

So raise your glass to the mystical old CMP restores.

Cheers Phil

[Bob Carriere]

...if I get rid of all my old stuff I will deeply disappointment my friends who are waiting for me to die so they can beat the scrappy.

I think there is enough "piss" left in me to complete the cab 11 and one more.... the rest is for my ( enter appropriate number) retirement fund.

Hoping to "Tip toe through the tulips with you...."

Bob C

Cheers

[chris vickery]

I am of the mindset that each vehicle rescued from the scrapper is at least in temporary custody of someone who actually cherishes it. Having said this, I think most of us collectors should also understand our limitations, both financially and physically, and to pass on workable projects when the right guy comes along.
There are simply to many hoarders among the community who prevent viable projects from ever being done as they continually rust away. I am not talking about the guy down the road who has a so and so that he's gonna fix one day, rather the collector who has way too much for the years and resources he actually has available. But I suppose thats what a free country is all about.
Help the hobby out and get more guys involved!
I agree wholeheartedly Stuart, too many classics are relegated to trailer queens or garage queens and should be used as intended...

[Phil Waterman]

Hi All

Then we have the collectors, conservators, superheros who sweep in and rescue the restorable and the unrestorable from under the noses of the scrappers who would take CMPs and other old pieces of mechanical history to their finial resting place.

Over the years I have been the recipient of parts salvaged from trucks well past restoration, but those individual parts have helped restore another truck. These parts were saved, not by someone who planned to restore that particular truck, but rather by people who just didn't want to see the truck go to the scrapper.

But then again over the years we have seen people on MLU restore something that most of us thought was un-restorable.

Cheers Phil

[chris vickery]

Phil, kudos to the superheroes, without them many a vehicle would now be a Walmart toaster...
My key point is that in order to introduce new blood into the hobby we must make available resonably priced entry level projects for young or new enthusiasts to start with. There are also those of us enthusiastic to build one, two or many vehicles yet sourcing decent projects is very difficult.
It becomes frustrating when you look over your fellow collectors fence to a yard full of vehicles which truthfully, will never be restored by the owner.
This becomes a case of "look at me, look what I have and you don't..."
I truly believe that there is a class of enthusiasts which I shall name "collectors", those who never have and never will do anything other than to gather relics like squirrels gather nuts. On one hand, yes they are saved. On the other hand, for how long? Either the owner passes on and the family relegates it all to the scrapper anyhow or by the time enthusiastic restoration specialists come along they are too far gone.
Parking a bunch of collected vehicles in the middle of a hayfield or bushlot and you might as well send them to scrap to begin with as no level of preservation has been done to slow them from deterioration. Case in point, my neighbour with his CDLV242 Willys MB which has been sitting in the same place I saw it 10 years ago (he is going to restore it...)
I did know one collector at least who parked his stuff on gravel and oil soaked everything on a yearly basis.

[Rob Fast]

restoration passion is the international flavour that comes with it. You can log onto MLU at any time during the Canadian 24 hour day and see the Aussies waking up to this forum, followed by the Europeans and Uk. Cmp'ers. I may have my time zones a little out of whack here but you get my drift. I would like to see a little more input from the fellow restorers in South America...and the more obscure places where CMP's are still running. If only we could inspire young collectors/restorers with the global phenomena of CMP's.

[chris vickery]

I agree Rob. There is a whole gamut of cmp restorers I am sure in places that you mention. Thing is, I think many are disconnected with the internet. Even here in Canada it always suprises me to find out how many collectors are private and shy away from organized clubs or forum websites...

[David Dunlop]

I agree, it would be great to connect with some other areas of the globe we know, CMP's went during the war, but perhaps to some extent language is an issue, and I also wonder if political climates play a large roll in limiting what collectors can do in some parts of the world. Would you want to be an avid military vehicle collector in a country run my constantly changing military governments?

David

[Robert Bergeron]

Friends,

Historical military vehicles and old cars are not the same.

This summer i paraded WW2 and Korean war veterans before the crowd at our local airshow at the airport in a WW2 GPW and a F-15A Cmp . A Corvette would not of made the grade...

What a great reception the Vets got !

Yesterday , i brought the 1944 GPW to a WW2 veteran's funeral. His 5 sons and one daughter were all there around me as if i was their father's long lost buddy he had last seen in Antwerp ! They were so thankfull i felt a little self conscious for the attention i got.

I bring at least two trucks to the local Cenotaph for Remembrance day . I have had veterans drive them in convoy for old times sake. They really, really appreciate .

Our hobby is alive and well, we just have to outreach and get involved with and in the community .

The point is , we are custodians of historic military artefacts not just collectible old sport cars. Let's show them to the kids and folks so they learn their history.

My two cents.

Bob

[hrpearce]

Since this poll started several responders have moved up an age group making it not entirely accurate today.
As the numbers change it appears the age of entry into this forum is around 41 +.

[Jordan Baker]

Thanks so much for making us all feel that much older. Although I'm happy to still be in the under 35 group.

[Bruce Parker (RIP)]

Originally Posted by Jordan Baker

Thanks so much for making us all feel that much older. Although I'm happy to still be in the under 35 group.

Blink and you'll be celebrating your 50th birthday wondering what the hell happened. Ask me how I know. I can still pound steel and reach into the bowls to change fuel pumps and the like so things aren't that bad.

[rob love]

I am not any older myself, but I have to say that hatches on armoured vehicles have shrunk, and I no longer jump off any vehicle.

[hrpearce]

Looks like I'm the one raising the average age here then. Still getting the work done just steadied off to enjoy the view.
Bring on next year and the three day working week, looking forward to that.

[Jon Bradshaw]

I just saw this post while looking thru this area of the forum. I have never explored this part and have been on here for years. I am 41 and have been getting into this hobby for about 10 years now. I am known to a few of you out there and meet a few as I travel across the country each summer as the "MLU express". As the older gentlemen sell off the collections I am confidant that the younger people will buy the vehicles that are restored. The old basket cases in the back 40 are the ones that will end up going for scrap. Many of the younger generation (myself included) don't have the skills of working on engines because the cars we have now are mostly computer and don't require fixing as much as part swapping. I have taught myself how to weld and tinker but still need plenty of help when it comes to the finer points of working on an engine. Carbs are a simple looking thing until they don't work right, then I don't know how to set them back correctly.
In summary I think the hobby will continue but the value will soon top out as the restored vehicles become more available, parts will be the big value. Since even restored vehicles will continue to break.

[maple_leaf_eh]

Originally Posted by Robert Bergeron

...
I bring at least two trucks to the local Cenotaph for Remembrance day . I have had veterans drive them in convoy for old times sake. They really, really appreciate .

Our hobby is alive and well, we just have to outreach and get involved with and in the community .

...

I do something similar at my Legion Branch's parades. The vets get to drive/ride while I march.

Terry

[Ed Landstrom]

I haven't seen any statistics to back it up, but there's a popular theory that the current crop of teenagers aren't interested in learning to drive, let alone restore, because it would interfere with the time they spend on their electronic devices. According to this theory, getting his driver's license on his 16th birthday is no longer a boy's major goal. Even if he is interested in military vehicles, driving one on a game console is better than driving on a road in every way (cheaper, safer, cleaner, more comfortable, and he doesn't have to leave his patents' basement to do it).

If this theory is correct, we may run out of Uber drivers. It's a good thing autonomous vehicles are almost ready, or no one would be able to get around.

My children learned to drive quite a while ago, and none of their children are quite there yet, so I don't have any personal experience with the supposed phenomenon, but there must be people on here who can comment.

[chris vickery]

Ed, todays generation of Millennials scares the crap out of me for more than one reason. Not all of them, mind you, but most.
Its easy to assume that as we get older we become our parents, simply complaining about the way today's youth acts, their attitudes etc.
This time though, I really think kids are different, and in a bad way.
Self entitlement, lack of empathy, no morals, unable to maintain personal relationships, the list goes on.
Time to hide under a rock.

[Lang]

Well,

I was starting to think the same thing but realized there is hope.

When we started the Military Jeep Club of Queensland (all military vehicles and possibly the largest Military club in Australia) back in 74 we used to have serious bush runs. Often with 30 vehicles with mud, steep country, creek crossings or beach runs. These were family oriented and heaps of kids came along.

A large number drove vehicles in controlled situations away from the road. My daughter could drive a blitz easily at 12 years old.

As time went by the kids grew out of going on trips with their parents and the club changed to a membership of paraders and showers, not users. I think this was a combination of the increase in cost and an ageing group.

Many of the old crew who did not mind getting their vehicles dirty continued but runs became smaller and definitely more sedate.

I was starting to lose interest but quite suddenly those kids of the 70's, 80's and 90's started to re-emerge with their own kids after a break to make a living and raise a family.

We now have strong bush camping often with more than 50 vehicles, very family oriented with herds of rug-rats in their mini-jeeps, climbing trees, exploring the bush, falling in the creek and getting covered in mud. You can see the great majority from about 8 years old being taught to drive a jeep by their dad. By the time they reach 14 or 15 they are full-on driving off road and dad just sits there beside them.

I do despair about today's button and screen do-nothing generation but when I see those other kids I think there is hope for the world.

Lang

[Gordon Yeo]

Golly Chris, your assessment of todays youth sounds like an indictment of the parents! The old expression is, the apple doesn't fall far from the tree.

[Phil Waterman]

Hi Lang

I hope your version of a MV hobby is a growing reality. We've seen some what the same growth of the hobby when we were in our 30s and 40s . We would have 30-40 vehicles going out on trail rides and lots of people showing for parades then as that core group aged the numbers dropped. The trail rides got to be dirt roads rides but we kept going.

Recenctly here in the US I've been seeing a growth in the hobby with a group of younger people getting into the MV hobby. If you have not checked out SteelSoldiers web site do so.

I'll dig out their URL address and also find their demographic page. My only lament with SteelSoldiers forum is that they don't use real names using web handles instead. Which for me takes away from the community feeling I have for MLU. But that may be a reality of younger generation and the internet.

But again thanks Lang, your next to the last paragraph gives me hope.

Cheers Phil

PS Link to SteelSoldiers demographic https://www.steelsoldiers.com/showth...iers-users-age
General forum web address https://www.steelsoldiers.com

Also our big summer rally has seen growth in the last few years, with an infusion of people of younger people coming with thier kids.

[Alex van de Wetering]

Could we close this poll anytime soon??.....as I am slowly approaching the second biggest age group.....making the poll result totally useless

Alex

[rob love]

Originally Posted by Alex van de Wetering

Could we close this poll anytime soon??.....as I am slowly approaching the second biggest age group.....making the poll result totally useless

Alex

Lucky you. I am only a couple years from leaving the largest group.

[colin jones]

Now this is an interesting poll. Perhaps Hanno you could get it place it in a predominate place at the top of the forum so everyone can put their vote in considering how many are registered here. This is the first time I saw it.