“1941 CMP Amphibious vehicle” (4x4)

[Harry Moon]

I contacted the seller and asked for some info, the ad itself has several more pictures. I got the pictures of the engine plate. It wasn't made in Canada but by Yellow Truck & Coach Manufacturing in Pontiac Michigan. Looking into Yellow, which was bought by GM at the end of 42, I found the records of how many DUKW's they made along with several 6X6 models Interestingly they only made 49 4X4 trucks and only in 1942 but curiously the reference has a question mark where the model would be listed. My curiosity is got me going.

[Harry Moon]

Also the serial number on the frame matches the engine,(as presented) Mysteries.

[Hanno Spoelstra]

Great to see the MLU fraternity diving into this mystery!

From what I know and what I read here I'd say this vehicle is at best a post war military conversion of a GMC DUKW, but much more likely a postwar civilian conversion using some CMP components.

After WW2 in the Netherlands, many GMC CCKW trucks were converted for civilian use to haul dirt/soil. As the load was at least doubled, frames were strengthened or replaced, diesel engines were fitted and axles were replaced by CMP GM C60X axles as they are stronger than the original GMC axles. I suspect that is what happened here.

A number of Italian military vehicles had a steering wheel on the right to cope with driving conditions on narrow (mountain) roads, so that may be a reason why this vehicle was converted to RHD if it is of Italian origin.

There must have been a solid reason for this conversion, it is too much work for a "folly" or an April's fools joke.

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[Jakko Westerbeke]

Originally Posted by Hanno Spoelstra

From what I know and what I read here I'd say this vehicle is at best a post war military conversion of a GMC DUKW, but much more likely a postwar civilian conversion using some CMP components.

If it is a conversion from a DUKW, it seems to be a pretty extensive one. It proved a little difficult to find decent DUKW drawings online, but even with a poor-resolution one overlaid on the photo, it’s clear that if this is a converted DUKW hull, a lot of cutting must have been involved:

DUKW-CMP hybrid.jpg

The shape of the front wheel well is different both at the front and rear, the rear wheel well is much smaller and squarer, not to mention further forward, the whole foredeck and the cowls alongside the cab are different, etc.

[Ed Storey]

So this isn't a rare Canadian vehicle that landed in Sicily in 1943? Oh darn!

[Paul Hazen]

This vehicle was published in 1989 in the magazine Wheels & Tracks number 29. Even then, it was a mystery. It did say that it originally came from an Italian fire brigade.

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[Hanno Spoelstra]

Originally Posted by Paul Hazen

This vehicle was published in 1989 in the magazine Wheels & Tracks number 29. Even then, it was a mystery. It did say that it originally came from an Italian fire brigade.

Thanks for digging this out, Paul! I knew I had seen it before somewhere. The way it is currently advertised does not help to establish its true provenance.

[Hanno Spoelstra]

Originally Posted by Jakko Westerbeke

If it is a conversion from a DUKW, it seems to be a pretty extensive one. It proved a little difficult to find decent DUKW drawings online, but even with a poor-resolution one overlaid on the photo, it’s clear that if this is a converted DUKW hull, a lot of cutting must have been involved:

The shape of the front wheel well is different both at the front and rear, the rear wheel well is much smaller and squarer, not to mention further forward, the whole foredeck and the cowls alongside the cab are different, etc.

A detailed study of the hull structure may yield insights into whether the "Italian fire brigade duck" was converted from a DUKW hull or is some sort of copy.

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[Jakko Westerbeke]

I take it the first two photos are of the CMP conversion, since it has the steering wheel on the right-hand side, while the last photo is of a DUKW? If so, I’d say the CMP is a copy/“inspired by” rather than having been adapted from a DUKW. It looks like somebody had a DUKW at hand and thought, “We need another vehicle like that, let’s build something much like it on this CMP we also have.”

[David Herbert]

I agree with Jakko. It is too professional a construction to be home made or a mock up or a scam and I see no evidence that it is a conversion of a DUKW - there are too many structural differences and no signs of modifaction to the wheel arches which are different to DUKW ones.

I think that the most likely explanation is that it is a post war Italian construction using then readily available new or nearly new CMP parts.

David

[Hanno Spoelstra]

Originally Posted by Jakko Westerbeke

I take it the first two photos are of the CMP conversion, since it has the steering wheel on the right-hand side, while the last photo is of a DUKW?

Yes,...

If so, I’d say the CMP is a copy/“inspired by” rather than having been adapted from a DUKW. It looks like somebody had a DUKW at hand and thought, “We need another vehicle like that, let’s build something much like it on this CMP we also have.”

... plus I think they used some of the more intricate fittings like the propeller drive line and ducts to construct an amphibious vehicle for fire brigade/ emergency services.

The % of DUKW components is anyone's guess, this is very much a case of "Trigger's Broom". US-based operators of DUKWs have extensively rebuilt and modified DUKWs to a stage where they are a mere "dataplate restoration/ reconstruction" like many of the warbirds flying today

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[Jordan Baker]

Harry.

The engine is a GMC270. All of them were made by Yellow Truck and Coach. It’s the same basic engine as found in the Otter, Fox, C15TA and C60X