16" 8 bolt Split Rims for 1.5 ton Australian Chevrolet Trucks

[Philippe Jeanneau]

Hello Hanno,

Indeed, I am very grateful to Stuart Kirkham for going out of his way to get this information for me... It has been a year for me trying to come up with accurate verifiable information and it is not easy! As for the specifics of this particular wheel, there seems to be some confusion... I cannot exactly say at this time who manufactured this 16" (8 Bolt) split wheel, (English, Canadian, or Australian) but we know it is indeed 16" X ?? and it exists... I just find it hard to believe that no one else has come forward with any more detailed photos of it to nail it down once and for all...

All I am trying to do is to come up with something very close to it, still working on it as an option using the backspaces from the 16" solid wheels I had made recently... The tires could be the Goodyear (R-3) 9.50-16, but ideally it would be the 10.50-16 (R-3) style tire that I'm trying to bring forward also... I will check the specs for your Simex tires, thank you...

As for my truck, I initially wanted to recreate a truck similar to TE-HAI (T9) but I quickly realized that it would be a shame to cut such a nice cab; secondly, it was beyond my resources/means to remove my existing rear box and recreate the new one exactly as that truck in the IWM... Combined with that, the extreme difficulty in getting all the necessary information or measurements/templates to make it happen... Going at it alone, it would take me years! On the plus side, I have finally been able to figure out the sand channels which will be a nice addition to the truck. Next are the front sand mat brackets, they may take some time but it will happen... Then I will have to find someone to make the mats, properly...

Back to your question, the type I have recreated is loosely based on a early LRDP vehicle that could have been used by anyone... Certainly not a fighting vehicle! I have seen many different early trucks with different configurations, so I thought that having a rear canvas and troop seats could be believable enough for now... At least it is the right color, the fenders are widened and have decent wheels... Somewhat of a decent start for a single effort... Someday I hope to come close to the IWM vehicle. In the meantime, I hope to make the 2 piece wheels and 10.50-16 sand tires a reality...

I certainly would appreciate any suggestions you may have to improve the project... Thank you.

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[Philippe Jeanneau]

Hello Hanno,

Back to the 16" or 18" wheel debacle/confusion... There is indeed a Australian made 18" (12 bolt) rim that was made... I discarded that option also for the difficulty in finding tires and being more expensive than the 16"...

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[Hanno Spoelstra]

Originally Posted by Philippe Jeanneau

As for the specifics of this particular wheel, there seems to be some confusion... I cannot exactly say at this time who manufactured this 16" (8 Bolt) split wheel, (English, Canadian, or Australian) but we know it is indeed 16" X ?? and it exists... I just find it hard to believe that no one else has come forward with any more detailed photos of it to nail it down once and for all...

All I am trying to do is to come up with something very close to it, still working on it as an option using the backspaces from the 16" solid wheels I had made recently... The tires could be the Goodyear (R-3) 9.50-16, but ideally it would be the 10.50-16 (R-3) style tire that I'm trying to bring forward also... I will check the specs for your Simex tires, thank you...

Seeing you sketch with measurements, I deducted the wheel diameter was 475mm, adjusting for measurement errors that's about 18 inch.

So indeed it is an unknown 16" split rim wheel. If a 10.5-16 tyre is fitted, the rim width should be 6.5" - this I deduct from a Michelin XL sheet for 9.00R16 and 11.00R16 tyres. Maybe it is 7" but no more than that.

So then it's option 3): buy 16" rims and modify those. The regular 16" W.D. split rim is assymetric and 6" wide. You could use these and widen them by having a .5"or 1" widening ring welded in the narrow half. There are many companies, epecially in the US, doing this.

[Andrew H.]

Hi Phillipe,
All this navel-gazing about rim sizes and bolt spacings is academic unless it is matched by equally diligent research about correct body styles, numbering and truck names – things that are far more readily visible to anyone admiring your truck.
For example, if the truck you are restoring has the "waterfall" (AKA "art deco") grille, that type of truck was not used by the LRDP. The Long Range Desert Patrol used the earlier 1939-40 WA Chevrolets which were significantly different in appearance. In the LRDP “Te Hai” was actually a Ford V8 15cwt and was numbered T3 (T9 was “Tutira”). It was not until March 1942 (by which time the LRDP had become the LRDG) that the waterfall grille trucks (eg 1533X2 and 1311X3) appeared in the LRDG. There are excellent books available on all of these topics.

[Wayne Henderson]

The truck with 10x50 tyres is one of several imports that arrived in Australia, diverted when Singapore fell. A 6 inch rim with 10 bolt stud pattern. Truck served in W.A. with Second Armoured, still carried overseas ARN on the bonnet.

[Philippe Jeanneau]

Hello Hanno,

The funny thing is that the sketch with the measurement of 475 mm or (18-45/64") corresponds to the truck in the Australian museum with 10-50-16 tires... I'm inclined to say that this 16" (10 bolt) wheel might be at least 7" wide or so, given the information I have from Stuart... For some added perspective, my solid 16"x 8" wheels measure 446.8 mm or (17-9/16") and still accommodate a 9.50-16 tire... So the true size, or circumference must be the area in contact with the tire bead... Both would have to be the same. Anything outside of that area is obviously irrelevant and may differ from manufacturer to manufacturer... Does that make sense?

To touch on Andrew H. comment, I have the earlier truck, identical to a WA model, which I have seen with solid 16" wheels (IWM) and what seems to be 16" split wheels (laying in the dessert) but I may be mistaken. Maybe someone else can shed light into that mystery also...

Rest assured that if I could get my hands on a bunch of CMP wheels (or any suitable wartime wheel for a Chevrolet) I would cut them and re center them to fit the bolt circle and backspace of my truck... But there is nothing like that here in USA...

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[Andrew H.]

Phillipe,
Thats a great looking WA Chev truck! And very appropriate for the LRDP if you remove the cab. Attached is a chart showing the various possible names and numbers to maintain authenticity. This is an extract from "Incident at Jebel Sherif" by well known authors Brendan O'Carroll and Kuno Gros. A great read if you can still get it. Apologies for straying off topic.

[Hanno Spoelstra]

Originally Posted by Philippe Jeanneau

The funny thing is that the sketch with the measurement of 475 mm or (18-45/64") corresponds to the truck in the Australian museum with 10-50-16 tires... I'm inclined to say that this 16" (10 bolt) wheel might be at least 7" wide or so, given the information I have from Stuart... For some added perspective, my solid 16"x 8" wheels measure 446.8 mm or (17-9/16") and still accommodate a 9.50-16 tire... So the true size, or circumference must be the area in contact with the tire bead... Both would have to be the same. Anything outside of that area is obviously irrelevant and may differ from manufacturer to manufacturer... Does that make sense?

To touch on Andrew H. comment, I have the earlier truck, identical to a WA model, which I have seen with solid 16" wheels (IWM) and what seems to be 16" split wheels (laying in the dessert) but I may be mistaken. Maybe someone else can shed light into that mystery also...

Rest assured that if I could get my hands on a bunch of CMP wheels (or any suitable wartime wheel for a Chevrolet) I would cut them and re center them to fit the bolt circle and backspace of my truck... But there is nothing like that here in USA...

Hello Philippe,

Re. "does that make sense?": as to the measurement of wheels, I compared Stuarts measurements with the basics of wheel geometry:

The wheel diameter is measured at the tyre bead location. So the subject wheel has a diameter of 16", which means that 16" tyres will fit. Apparently Stuart measured the diameter from flange to flange, obviously more than 16". The rim width is also measured at tyre bead level. This will probably be 7", given the overall rim width is approx 9.5".

The pictures you posted of the Chevrolet WA (they state it is a WB) at the IWM show a single piece rim not unlike the one you have on your truck. You plan to add a fatter tyre and plan to have tyres manufactured. I do understand you'd like the diamond sand pattern, but you could also see if a tyre like the 11.00-16 Michelin XZL is available in your region. It has a nice chunky military appearance and they are obviously larger than bar tread 9.00-16 tyres.

If you want to fit split rims, chances are one of the Canadian MLU members could source a set of 4 or 5 standard 16" W.D. spilt rims for you, strap them to a pallet and have them shipped to Florida via a backload or grouped transport. If you're not in a hurry shipping should not break the bank. Just place a wanted ad on here and see what the reactions are.

Or just use the yellow rim you posted if those fit your hubs already.

I agree with Adrew, let's not make this too academic. You've got a great truck as it is, finding the unfindable wheels and going down the path of having tyres manufactured, will not add much joy to owning this truck. Well that just my 2 cents worth

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[Philippe Jeanneau]

Hello Hanno,

You're absolutely right, the differences in the measurements have to do with wheel geometry, so we're in complete agreement... Indeed, I tried to recreate the solid wheels from the truck (wish I could see the data tag) at the IWM as best I could; first, finding a company willing to do it and then dealing with whatever new materials were currently available. Aside from the technical constraints of not having the original HD Timken hubs on the front axle...

At any rate, it is done, and I'm happy with that...BUT, by adding a fatter tire I only wanted to again, be closer to the original as possible, and with a pattern used back then...At almost 35" x 10" the original Goodyear R-3's would fill the wheel well nicely, as opposed to the 32" x 9" profile of the current model. Yet, I picked the R3's because they were the only thing available, and the closest available in size...

While on the subject still, I would prefer the Dunlop Sand Tire (similar to modern turf tire) but there is only one person with a set in the world, and appears it will remain that way... I cannot find any information whatsoever, other than "Reinforced for Heavy Service" don't know what the model was called back then, or any construction details... So again, I went with what I could find here and now... As for the 11.00-16 Michelin XZL's the only few available in new condition were priced at almost $700.00 USD from a Dodge Power Wagon dealer! so you can understand why at that point I thought, buy some tires that are reasonable now, and then make a bloody mold-produce a tire that will be proportionate, as the WWII tire was...

The other problem with the Michelin 11.00-16 XZL tire is the size... At about 38"in diameter it is way too tall for the front end of the truck... The 900-16's might be the closest to the truck at 36.1", but again they're unobtanium... So round and round we go!...

As for the split rims, I think I am going to go your route, since so far, I cannot find anyone to make them... Amazingly, the yellow rim looks identical to the wartime rim but I am yet to receive a go on that with my specifications...

I wasn't trying to be too academic (I know the topic has been beaten to death to some extent) but, just like my truck cannot really be a frontline LRDG truck because of the cab, I have to find another role for it that would be plausible... As I appreciate Andrew's insight/information regarding the WA trucks on his list, I do not want to take away in any shape, miss-represent be disrespectful or grossly inaccurate by borrowing one of the truck numbers... So, I still need help in that area...

The unfindable wheels are in Australia, the unfindable tires in the UK... They may not add much more joy, but unfortunately for me, I'd love to have them, for I am a perfectionist!

Thank you, I do get your point, though the other side, the satisfaction is knowing the intricate details of how it was built, even though I may never be able to do it myself...

[Hanno Spoelstra]

Originally Posted by Philippe Jeanneau

Thank you, I do get your point, though the other side, the satisfaction is knowing the intricate details of how it was built, even though I may never be able to do it myself...

I recognise that and you are to be recommended for getting the details right