Info needed: ARN stencils- Size and style

[Jacques Reed]

Hi Tony,

Thanks for the link. Think I better live until 110 to do all the things I would like to do!

Cheers,

[Mike Cecil]

Jacques,

I don't think the '45988' is the ARN, but the Unit Serial Number for the 106th Anti-tank Regiment, which later changed to the 106th Tank Attack Regiment (AIF). If you had rubbed beneath that number lower down the panel, you would probably have uncovered three parallel bars of colour, which made up the other part of the Unit Embarkation Sign. All covered in detail in my book 'Aust Army Units and Unit Serials of the Second World War', now out of print.

I think ARN 45988 was a Cab 12 3-ton CMP, not a Cab 13.

ARN specs typically specified numerals 3 inch to 3 1/2 inch high, with no part of the figures less than 1/2 inch wide, in white paint.

Your image of the '53166' truck also shows the remains of the Bridge Sign - an irregular patch of yellow paint approximating 8 inches in diameter. Hope you kept the image of that to replicate for your truck.

Regards

Mike

[Jacques Reed]

Hi Mike,

Thanks for that info. I gave that cowl to a mate so I will ask him if he could kindly rub it back below the 45988 to verify. It was beyond hope of restoration and I was running out of space here in the burbs anyway.

It came off an F15-A truck with ARN 55166 based on the transmission s/n. I thought the cowl may have been swapped from another truck thinking the unit number was the ARN, but perhaps the ARN 55166 is under the red paint higher up? More sanding please mate!

I rescanned the cowl 53166 photo negative with my new scanner at a higher resolution. Not much extra detail however came to hand. At least playing with various photo enhancement settings helped to make the details on the image more visible. Most of the numbers and bridge disk were almost invisible on the printed photo.

Any chance you will do a reprint of the book?

Cheers,

[Mike Cecil]

Hi Jacques,

The ARN may be above or below, ie along the top edge or the bottom edge of the panel, with the Unit Embarkation Sign bars of colour most likely below the USN. The bars may be either vertical or horizontal - most likely horizontal, with the top and bottom bars being the same colour representing the second last digit of the USN.

Be interested to see what your mate turns up when he rubs the panel back.

The book: hardly a best seller, so I doubt it would ever go to a reprint. With so few about, it's now a 'rare book'!!

Best regards

Mike

[Ganmain Tony]

From my F15 Jacques, for your reference.

It appears to be done in free hand. Looks good in my opinion

[Jacques Reed]

Hi Tony,

Thanks for posting that photo. It shows what Tony Smith said about sign writers doing the job of painting the numbers on the vehicles. Each has their individual style.

The "5" on your cowl has a definite flourish, I think that is the word for it, on the top bar compared to the straight edge on ARN 53166. Different writers, different styles within the specs that Mike mentioned.

And for Mike- I should have bought the book when it came out!

Cheers,

[Tony Wheeler]

Originally Posted by Mike Cecil

Be interested to see what your mate turns up when he rubs the panel back.

Hi Mike,

The abovementioned mate is me. It's been a while since we conversed, I trust you're well these days. Jacques mentioned this thread to me and I was interested to read your information concerning the 45988 marking, which previously had me puzzled, as I was unfamiliar with the USN marking system. Further rubbing back revealed the coloured bars on the opposite side, which measure approx 8" x 1 1/2" with approx 3/4" separation. They've been obliterated prior to repaint but the edges are still quite discernible. Also visible on that side is some remnant numbering, presumably shipping information. The USN itself has been applied on a patch of Dark Blue applied over Light Tone disruptive colour to provide sufficient background contrast. Strangely there's no sign of the ARN having been applied. Remnant black paint may indicate TAC sign but there's no evidence of formation sign having been applied.

Regarding the colour code, it's my understanding the digit 8 is indicated by Service Colour in the British system, which I imagine could be either KG3 or SCC2 Brown depending on the period. Australian Army Service Colour was KG3 but in late '43 the colour Medium Green was officially approved as an alternative basic colour: "Khaki Green No 3 or Vehicle Medium Green is now the basic colour for all vehicles." This would lead me to conclude the coloured bars seen here are Medium Green denoting 88. I'll be interested to hear your thoughts.

Cheers, Tony

[Mike Cecil]

Hi Tony,

Well, the front shell ended up in good hands then.

The figure '8' was indeed represented by the colour 'Service Colour, GS', whatever that was at the time of application. Odd that the bars were applied away from the number: the two were usually mated together for quick visual recognition (the colour bars) then confirmation of the USN. Having them separated would slow down the process.

In practice, the colour for 8 was simply green - whatever medium/khaki green the applicator could lay his hands on. The system applied to all a units' kit, so multiple persons and not always the same can of green paint resulted in some wide variations of 'service colour, GS'. I had a collection of various personal kit that had the bar system applied, plus other examples, so have had a chance to see the variations.

Regards

Mike

[Tony Wheeler]

Originally Posted by Mike Cecil

In practice, the colour for 8 was simply green - whatever medium/khaki green the applicator could lay his hands on.

Thanks Mike, that explains it for me: any old green will do, as long as it's recognizably darker than the lighter green used to indicate the figure '4'.

Originally Posted by Mike Cecil

Odd that the bars were applied away from the number: the two were usually mated together for quick visual recognition (the colour bars) then confirmation of the USN. Having them separated would slow down the process.

Yes, and even more odd when you consider the Dark Blue background - why not simply put the USN on the LHS where there's no Light Tone disruptive colour to be overpainted.

I came across this scan of the US Army POM instruction (Preparation for Overseas Movement) which I've tried to correlate with the original British system from which it derives. I'm assuming they used essentially the same colors and names (except for OD in lieu of Service Colour) and merely shuffled them around a bit. Are you able to confirm please.

Cheers,

Tony