Now I'm excited

[DaveBuckle]

So many thanks to Tony Smith for revealing that my 'new' C15A was an AALMG truck.
I am keen to know if it is possible to find out where it was based, unit markings and what it looked like in service.
I bought this vehicle out of a shed where it has had either new or recoed: engine, carby, radiator, dizzy, fuel pump, wheel cyclinders, brake lines, exhaust, tyres etc. etc. tho the cab is fairly shot.
So therefore I sourced an excellent early/mid cab and toolbox/spare wheel carrier for it with the intention to create a North Africa representation.
However I am thinking it would be more (can't think of the words) of me to recreate it as it was.
I have attached pic of chassis number the cab came off in case it has some significance if anyone can interpret where/what that history is - seemed to be a C30A. Think it is: 33443S01115?
I appreciate any thoughts, input

[Tony Smith]

38443S is a 1943 year model (ie likely built 1944) C60L (158" wb) assembled in Sydney (GM-H plant at Pagewood). 01115 is the 1115th chassis built that year.

It would be very of you to try and retain as much of the vehicle's original history as possible, as once it's gone it can never be found again. (What is that word? )

[Luke R]

Would I be correct in thinking AALMG is Anti Aircraft Light Machine Gun?

[DaveBuckle]

Thanks again Tony - buoyed by what you have told me already I have attached pix of chassis number - plus pix of tags below passenger windscreen and under bonnet hoping this reveals more about this Blitz.
And yes Luke, Tony tells me it is Anti Aircraft Light Machine Gun!
Keen as to know what that looks like.
And were Sunshine cabs a late war thing?

[Keith Webb]

That's better, 8444 is the GM code for a C15A, the roadster cab is the sunshine roof. The earlier 8443 was for a C60L, or 158" wheelbase. So your corrected chassis number will need to be discovered in AWM 126 to find out it's original configuration. Most were fitted with the Australian No2 or 2A GS rear body which itself had a number of different fit outs such as Office for example.
So hold your horses on the AALMG bit - many were fitted with that mount on the LH side of the cab for a bren gun. Tony's information was based on a different chassis number.

There was a Polsten version of a C15A but yours is not yet confirmed.

[Keith Webb]

Your truck was a model WO16 Battery Staff Wireless which used a GS steel body. It was not a Wireless Signals van, just carried a wireless. Your ARN was 65638 and engine number WR3821667.

So alas, no AALMG.

[DaveBuckle]

Ah, OK - so this number on the bonnet that gave Tony the AALMG info does not match what the chassis number tells us?

[Keith Webb]

That's right - they were not numbered on top of the bonnet - it was either side of the bonnet so the number is spurious and happened to link to a different truck.

ARN 65638 is based on your chassis number and is the correct one for your truck. At least you now know!

Originally Posted by DaveBuckle

Ah, OK - so this number on the bonnet that gave Tony the AALMG info does not match what the chassis number tells us?
Attachment 102913

[DaveBuckle]

I see - thankyou very much (say it like Elvis)
Does the info on the tags guarantee it is the original cab for that chassis?

[Keith Webb]

Originally Posted by DaveBuckle

I see - thankyou very much (say it like Elvis)
Does the info on the tags guarantee it is the original cab for that chassis?

Those tags are normally just internal factory production numbering with no correlation - WO FRT END is a generic title... the more telling thing is the roadster cab which applied to C15As mostly, so it is likely the original cab. I assume the data plate on top of the dash is missing.
Are you able to find the ARN under the paint in front of the windscreens?

[Keith Webb]

Incidentally chassis number 2844400439S was at Corowa for Year of the Blitz in 2002 - ARN 65644 but I don't have a pic handy. Unsure who owned it.

[DaveBuckle]

It was NRMA tow vehicle after the war - there only seems to be a couple of layers of that ...
Will have to return rear springs to original configuration - beefed up to support jib and winch.

er, why I my photos now turning upside down?!

[DaveBuckle]

I'll be darned (at Corowa) - I bought it off local well-known family business - ol Dad had been doing it up in shed until he passed away bout 10 years ago. Nowra (Sth Coast NSW) area.

[DaveBuckle]

Ah hang on, sorry, not my truck - couple of feet down the assembly line ...

[Hanno Spoelstra]

Originally Posted by DaveBuckle

er, why I my photos now turning upside down?!

I'm not going to make any remarks about where you live....

[Luke R]

Anyone got some pictures of what a AALMG Blitz should look like anyway?

[Keith Webb]

Originally Posted by Luke R

Anyone got some pictures of what a AALMG Blitz should look like anyway?

Mike Cecil would know for certain but I think AALMG just refers to the gallows mount fitted to so many CMPs and other Australian vehicles AALMG = Anti-aircraft light machine gun. Those mounts were counterbalanced to support a bren gun, so nothing special.

It was positioned so a gunner could stand in the hatch and use the bren/gallows combination for protection from aircraft.

There was a SP Bofors version but that's another story.

[Keith Webb]

A couple of quick and low-res images, the F15A with Sunshine Roof has a rather bent AALMG mount - they were very susceptible to being hit by branches or low roofs by drivers who forgot they were there... and the other is the Bofors SP version on a F60L.

[Jacques Reed]

Hi Keith and David,

I don't want to go too far off topic but as this thread has been identifying vehicles I thought I might add a few observations.

Zooming in on your photo of the F15-A with the bent gallows gives an ARN of 132159 which shows as a Battery Staff vehicle in the AWM records.

Was nice to see the 2 gallon foam extinguisher on the drivers side bracket as Mike Cecil pointed out to me a few weeks back. Also the 5 ton bridge disk and wheel valance storage lockers. Thanks again Mike. Still don't know what the bracket above the extinguisher is for. Radio mast maybe?

The question I have is from the ARN book extract posted here.

ARN 132156 list it as type "H" and ARN 132158 list it as type "GA" Both are Battery staff if the ditto marks from a previous entry are correct. So what are "H" and "GA" type vehicles?

My parts truck seems to be originally a Battery Staff vehicle based on the transmission s/n which gives it an ARN of 55166. The foam extinguisher holder and sunshine roof adds to the likelihood. Pity the sunshine roof is so rotted away however that the only thing salvageable are some of the fittings.

Cheers,

[Mike Cecil]

Dave,

From the other thread you showed the image in:

"Dave Buckle: the number 61176 over three coloured bars on the bonnet is not an ARN, but the Unit Serial Number. The ID of the unit and the explanation of the three colour-coded bars system is explained in my book 'Australian Army Units and Unit Serials of the Second World War,' available from Virtual bookworm (unless some other Forum member has a copy handy?) Not a marking that usually survives."

Battery Staff vehicles came in various loadings, designated by a letter or letter combination, eg H or GA. The Battery Staff vehicles, as mentioned in the other thread, were the ones for which the Sunshine Cab was originally designed. BS vehicles were withdrawn from service when the jungle division structure cam into being. Returned to OVPs, the fittings were removed and they were re-issued as standard GS vehicles.

The bracket above the 2 gallon Fire ext bracket is a standard Australian wireless aerial mount.

The AALMG was not the type descriptor for a truck fitted with a gallows-type LMG mount. The gallows mount was an early standard fitting on Aust CMPs, as was the fitting of brackets to allow the Bren LMG to stand in place of the rifle on the left side of the cab. The gallows mount was discarded by troops, and by 1943(? I'd have to check the date) was dropped from production. As far as I can gather, the CMP 15cwt AALMG was fitted with a flat bed with a Polsten 20-mm LAA mounting, or a smaller sized MG like a twin Bren mounting, but the type was soon converted to standard GS. I have found little paperwork on either the 15cwt AALMG or the 3 ton AALMG trucks. I have a 'requirements of units' listing which shows a total of 1,124 15 cwt and 498 3 ton AALMG trucks were required by the Australian Army in early 1943, divided up by the units & formation types requiring them. By that stage, all but 53 had been delivered from contractors 'less fitments', whatever that actually covers.


Mike

[Mike K]

Off topic but the gallows mount . I've seen original pics of them fitted on 1941 12cwt Plymouth GS vans , AKA utes .

Would take a brave soul to take aim at an attacking aircraft with a Bren gun

[Mike Cecil]

Mike,

I should have made my previous post clearer: the 'Mountings, Cab, AALMG (Aust)' commonly known as the gallows mount, was an item fitted to many Aust Army vehicles fitted with a roof hatch, not just CMPs. The gallows mount is covered in one of the MGO Equipment Memorandums No.7, pages 27-28). It was included in early production, but stopped later on because it proved to be so useless. Firstly, it snagged just about every tree and bush the truck drove near, and second, as Mike observed, who in their right mind would stand up inside a nice big ground target and take on a Zero or a Val with a Bren gun anyway? Much better to stop, bail out and take the Bren with you.

Mike

[DaveBuckle]

Thank you all for your informative input.
Bottom line is I guess: I should not feel bad about putting another cab on my chassis as I am not overriding any unique or significant history now that we know it wasn't responsible for shooting down 2 Vals and a Zeke while defending the wharf at Darwin ...
There was mention of rifle/bren storage in CMP cabs - can anyone verify the brackets in my replacement cab? (off a C60A)
It has the rifle butt holders on floor but also has what appears to be a horizontal and vertical metal loop and corresponding clamp for perhaps a bren parts bag?
Note sanded part under bonnet looking for numbers