VICKERS MK6B's resto

[James P]

Each and every time I roll in on this thread I am astounded by the labour invested and your abilities Colin.

[Richard Farrant]

Originally Posted by colin jones

I have been quite busy making the smoke launcher brackets and I need some details of the launcher itself if anyone has one.

Hi Colin,
I had to visit the Tank Museum this week and spotting the Vickers MkVIB I took the attached photo which may help you a little way, when making the smoke launchers.

regards,
Richard

[tankbarrell]

I have made those dischargers in the past and have drawings if needed.

[colin jones]

Thankyou James, Thank you Richard for the photo and Adrian the drawings would be a great help. While I am on the turrets I think it would be a good time to make them as well.

I have been doing lots of small unseen jobs to the turrets and bolting the ball races to the top of the hulls.

[colin jones]

No sooner you start a job in the morning the days gone Some days you just don't appear to achieve much for the hours put in.

[Howard]

Originally Posted by colin jones

No sooner you start a job in the morning the days gone Some days you just don't appear to achieve much for the hours put in.

Yeah, Colin. I can hardly see where you've been. Lift ya game!

[colin jones]

Sorry Howard, I lifted my game just for you I still have a few bits to do on the turrets yet but I'll get to them soon.

[Dave lean]

Hi Col, spoke with B, he's more than happy to provide two systems for each tank. If you have his number , give him a call to discuss requirements.

[colin jones]

Thanks for the number Dave. Turrets are almost completed as I have just done the other hatches, Aerial mounts, cable covers and a few other internal parts. They are getting close to final paint and fitting.

[Dave lean]

I'll try and get out during the week ( I need a break from Bathroom renos...) And besides I need to check the quality of your work.... Wouldn't want you to have to re-fabricate anything...........

[colin jones]

Thank goodness for that as I don't want to do the final coat until you have signed off on them and given me the "all clear"

[colin jones]

Thanks to Russ for the measurements, I have been busy making the trays that fit under the gun port. I have no Idea what this part does but it is on all these models.

[colin jones]

it has a opening on the bottom with a handle to empty something.

[colin jones]

Spent shells would be inside the turret so I don't think that is what it's for. The opening at the bottom is quite large for quick empty but for what. Perhaps someone else would have the answer.

[David Dunlop]

Morning, Colin.

The modern German Marder sports a 20mm Machine Cannon, the spent casings from which are ultimately ejected out of the vehicle down, and foreword to the top of the front hull. Not at all sure what happens to the disposable metal links, but they may be captured somehow inside the vehicle.

Ejection/Extraction systems for these kinds of weapons are an art form in themselves. The direction the empty casing goes can be controlled quite well with the design of the mechanism. Earlier in the thread, it was discussed the ammunition feeds for the two guns in the Vickers would have been from bins to the outside of the two guns. It would make sense, therefore, that spent casings, and perhaps links, ejected to the inside of the two guns and very likely downwards.

Is there anything about the turret design that suggests an open channel, or duct of some form exists between and forward of the guns that the casings could be directed through and out the front? There might be additional fittings in this area inside the turret to assist in the flow of empties to the outside that have not been recognized yet.

Anyone familiar with the operation of these two guns feel free to comment. Every little bit will help.

David

[colin jones]

Hi David, I think you are right on target . There is an opening at the front of the turret which I put down to a possible ventilation duct but it does fit in with tray area. Russ Gregg also thought it was for casings too but I also said they were ejected from the inside. It make sense now!! I don't have any drawings or pictures or the inside of that area but with some earlier comments of a casing bag inside under the guns is probably wrong.. It must be a fool proof and complicated system to get them out as a blockage would be very hard to clear. I guess that is one part I won't be making but it is good to know what it's for .
Colin

[colin jones]

Here's a couple of Photos Russ took for me of the one at Borden. I thought the opening was some sort of ventilation area.

[Bruce Parker (RIP)]

Originally Posted by colin jones

Here's a couple of Photos Russ took for me of the one at Borden. I thought the opening was some sort of ventilation area.

It turns with the turret so would be of little use as a ventilation item as it would only work when the turret was in on place. Spent cases collector does make sense and collecting brass in a bin that would be emptied 'after action' is just British enough to be possible. Though turning the turret to have it jingle down the side make little more sense that collecting it and just flinging it away by hand. A closer look at the Borden Vickers to see if there is a hole or chute on the mantlet might solve the mystery. Does the centre 'lid' piece hinge?

[45jim]

Looks like the rectangular opening on the bottom of the box should have a screen bolted in place. Seems logical that it could catch the casings and let them cool off without dropping them all over the upper hull.

[Colin Alford]

All,

There are a number of Vickers MG Manuals related to Tank and AFV mountings at this site:

https://vickersmg.blog/manual/tank-training/

The various .303 and .50 Vickers MG marks for use in Tanks and AFVs had cartridge ejection tubes fitted so that the ejection took place underneath the gun, forward and outside of the vehicle.

I am quite confident that the tray in question was the "cartridge case tray" mentioned in some of the linked documents.

One question that I have not worked through is why there appear to be 3 locations for belt boxes inside the turret. In:

https://vickersmg.files.wordpress.co...i-04-36-a1.pdf

under the description of "Mountings, M.G., No. 10, Mark 1" it states that
the mount was for "one .303-in. M.G. Mk. VI or IV and one .5-in. M.G. Mk. V. Alternately two .303-in. M.G. Mk VI or IV can be used in this mounting in light tanks, Mk V or VI." It goes on to state that "projections on the underside of the platforms are drilled for the belt box carrier"

Not having a good sense of the layout of the guns and trays for belt boxes, and also not knowing the dimensions of the trays, I wonder if the two outside trays are possibly used when two .303s were fitted and the central tray was used when a .50 was fitted?

Colin

[Grant Bowker]

Originally Posted by 45jim

Looks like the rectangular opening on the bottom of the box should have a screen bolted in place. Seems logical that it could catch the casings and let them cool off without dropping them all over the upper hull.

Is it possible the screen is a museum addition to stop the public from using the slot as a garbage can?

[colin jones]

Well that's another question answered. I think there will be quite a few Vickers Mkv1a/b experts here by the time I have finished.
I am pretty happy with the turret outcome now that it is sitting on top of "WOMBAT" and also my son Andrew was very keen to put the ball bearing in place and put a lot of bolts and nuts on as well. He's a very good helper

[Tim Lovelock]

Looking fantastic, if I win the lotto, I might knock on your door 😁

[RichardT10829]

Simply amazing, won’t be long before we get video of her mobile and under her own power !

[Bruce Parker (RIP)]

Originally Posted by colin jones

Well that's another question answered. I think there will be quite a few Vickers Mkv1a/b experts here by the time I have finished.
I am pretty happy with the turret outcome now that it is sitting on top of "WOMBAT" and also my son Andrew was very keen to put the ball bearing in place and put a lot of bolts and nuts on as well. He's a very good helper

Colin, so far the pics have been truly amazing, but now it's time to up the ante. How about a video of that turret going around?

[David Dunlop]

Good evening, Colin.

Thanks for posting the latest photos. WOMBAT is becoming a brilliant looking vehicle once again. Congratulations on all your work to date!

What strikes me about the photos is how incredibly cluttered the front of the vehicle is, by todays armour standards. In that light, the capture bin for spent casings under the gun mantlet is a truly smart design. It definitely keeps everything in one convenient place for the crew to deal with coming out of action. You can well imagine what they would have to be dealing with otherwise, trying to fish casings out from around ventilation and access hatches, not to mention having the casings underfoot.

Out of curiosity, is WOMBAT’s last known operational base very far from you? I think it would be great fun to take her back there for a drive around after all her years away. Assuming, of course, the base still exists and is available. A sort of ‘Then and Now Trip’.

Sheesh! Now I am getting excited about what that big old Meadows sounds like in a Vickers when it springs to life! You will have to go live on line for that Colin. I will definitely have my bowl of popcorn and cold beer ready for the show!

Cheers,

David

[colin jones]

Thankyou for your comments. Bruce I will do a video when I make the two traversing gearboxes and show how easy they rotate. At the moment Bowerbird rotates 360deg easily, Quiet and no obstructions but on Wombat there is one spot that is a bit sticky so I will lift it and powder chalk it to see where the problem is and grind some clearance for full rotation but apart from that they are good.

David, they certainly do have a very busy front on them and I think they still would have had the odd problem with a few empty shells inside getting caught in the wrong place and there would not be much room inside for two blokes having to bend down to keep it clean. The last operational base close to me that had these tanks is about 9 hours away so I probably won't do a trip there but I will endeavour to get them both in a formal display when they are both running.
I guess you could say they are formally back from the dead now that I have put their names back on them.

[colin jones]

I will have to start looking at the mechanicals pretty soon as most of the look at parts are done. That's going to be interesting. I still have lots of internal parts to make and fitting the turret baskets with supports will be a bit of a pain but they all gotta be done.

[David Dunlop]

Will you be able to do much preassembly of the power train outside of these tanks, Colin, or will all the bits have to go together inside?

If its the latter, I suspect it might be a cooler weather project.

David

[colin jones]

David, there is lots to do on the out side, and it's a plus for me that the front panels come off very easy. I have a lot of machining to do to make the front hubs and the turrets will have to come off again to do the baskets and associated components. We have just started winter here so I have quite a bit of cool weather ahead.
I don't think there is anywhere else in this world where you will see two of these tanks together and they are consecutive numbers of production as well so that was quite a coincidence too.