The "Z Arm" on CDN Jeeps

[r.morrison]

So Gentlemen......given this discussion (with a wee bit of wireless side line) would we be safe to say that the unit could have been/should have been/possibly /maybe....equipped with a Z Arm Gun Mount. It's neither here nor there to me. Having a look under the cowling, it doesn't look like there was one originally installed.
For what ever aspect comes out of this....we are thinking of having a couple of units made. We have the exterior mounting plate and the arm it self, but no ammo box attachment (ie: Rob Loves photos of Browning 1919 unit in the "for sale" section of this forum).
Anyone interested in one? Have not figured out cost and shipping at this point.
Will keep you posted and thanks to all who have contributed to this question....Robert

[rob love]

Originally Posted by r.morrison

So Gentlemen......given this discussion (with a wee bit of wireless side line) would we be safe to say that the unit could have been/should have been/possibly /maybe....equipped with a Z Arm Gun Mount.

I think you would be safer to say that a UN jeep in Cypress would not have/should not have, never had the GPMG swing arm. Without some photographic evidence, or at a minimum some anecdotal evidence, then you are just making another fantasy piece.

The ammo tray is also a fantasy item. I put one on my own Jeep, and it was because the M1919 I shoot uses 8x63mm. Since it comes in a larger box than the standard 7.62 NATO can, I had to make a tray to support the larger box. Normally a NATO can hooks onto the support bar on the side of the arm and is kept there by a 1' wide cargo strap.

On the one I recently sold, I think a previous owner liked my idea and copied it. It is certainly much more secure than having the can bouncing off the side of the standard mount.

[Ed Storey]

Thank you Rob for setting the record straight! Primary documentation, photographs, should be the preferred basis of any historically correct reconstruction and not the all too common; could have been/should have been/perhaps/maybe/I like it that way because it is different, fantasy reconstruction method.

Anecdotal evidence is always problematic as there are already too many stories that start with "my Grandmother's best friend's bingo partner once told me that she heard from the garbage man that he saw...."

Fantasy pieces, although perhaps great ego booster for the owner, in the end only muddy the waters when it comes to accurately preserving and recording these vehicles for future generations to enjoy.

So, a photograph of a 'Z' arm on a Canadian UN Jeep will answer the question, until then - fantasy piece.

[David Dunlop]

Expanding on one of the photos Rob Love posted earlier, here is a pair of UN Cdn jeeps in service in Cyprus and neither of them is MG equipped. Plates on the vehicles front to rear are: 08924 and 08929. Photo is from "MUSKETS TO MISSILES".


David

[Scott Bentley]

Granted they are US M151A1s loaned to the Canadians, but they do have C5s mounted (not on Z Arms mind you) on a UN Operation (UNEF). Is there where the confusion started I wonder?

[rob love]

Originally Posted by David Dunlop

Expanding on one of the photos Rob Love posted earlier, here is a pair of UN Cdn jeeps in service in Cyprus and neither of them is MG equipped. Plates on the vehicles front to rear are: 08924 and 08929. Photo is from "MUSKETS TO MISSILES".


David

Interesting that all three M38A1s in UN colours shown in this thread are late CFR Cdn3s. They are 08912, 08924 and 08929.

CFRs 08919 and 09049 also were UN jeeps according to photos posted over on Clive's Ramtank.ca site. http://ramtank.ca/m38a1list5.htm

Note the Cdn 3 CFRs ended at 09095.