Found: URGENTLY - Fan Pulley Ford Lynx 12V Generator

[Lynn Eades]

Rick, just to go back to the start, I would like to see the rest of the part number.
The #10130 is Fords root number, for a pulley, but the prefix will either identify it as from a standard vehicle or as a special lynx part.
Can you supply the whole number for interests sake?

[lynx42]

Originally Posted by Lynn Eades

Rick, just to go back to the start, I would like to see the rest of the part number.
The #10130 is Fords root number, for a pulley, but the prefix will either identify it as from a standard vehicle or as a special lynx part.
Can you supply the whole number for interests sake?

Hi Lynn, there is a number on the back of the pulley but I am not sure if I can see it now as it is all back together. I'll check tomorrow.

Meanwhile, the parts book has the following. Part Number 10130 on the diagram page and 01AS-10130D-Pulley Generator on the parts listing page.

Hope that this helps.

Regards Rick.

[motto]

Sounds like the bearings may have been 6203 Rick. These were/are used in a lot of generators and alternators and so are worth keeping a few around the place. I carried one as a spare after having a generator lock up on my Chev years ago. They even fit the cutting deck on my ride on mower.
A fellow was selling them for $2 each at the Bendigo Swap a couple of years back and I bought a number of them.

Dave

[lynx42]

Originally Posted by motto

Sounds like the bearings may have been 6203 Rick. These were/are used in a lot of generators and alternators and so are worth keeping a few around the place. I carried one as a spare after having a generator lock up on my Chev years ago. They even fit the cutting deck on my ride on mower.
A fellow was selling them for $2 each at the Bendigo Swap a couple of years back and I bought a number of them.

Dave

Yes, David, 6203 is the sealed bearing which I chose to put in. Won't have to oil the genny now.

Regards Rick.

[Lynn Eades]

Tony, Rick etc. Not sure about Ford, but here's a little on Lucas.
A Lucas 6 volt generator will produce 12 volts. It will in fact produce 50 volts, (unregulated) but not for long.
a 6 volt genny can be converted to 12 volt by changing the field coils in from a 12 volt genny. This however does not work in reverse as the 12 volt armature cannot handle the current. The wiring needs to be heavier for the 6 volt.
This works because Lucas have built 6 and 12 volt generators using the same basic design. In particular I have been able to build a 12 volt genny for my carrier using the end plates and armature that came from a model of generator that was only ever built as 6 volt (original carrier)

On the Ford pulley numbers. Those numbers are probably just casting numbers.
A Ford part number is usually made up of three parts:
Here is a basic run down.
The root number (eg 10130) refers to a generator pulley.
The prefix (eg 01AS) which denotes country and year of origin and particular vehicle application. (I have no reference material to decode the 01AS. This may mean the part is specific to the Lynx armoured car)
The last part is the suffix (in this case a "D")
The "D" denotes changes or improvements in that item and so you might have a pulley that to all intents is the same. however they may have added material to strengthen the design, improve the air flow from the fan, or maybe even dynamically balanced as opposed to a static balanced original (just trying to come up with examples) Each time a design improvement is introduced, the suffix changes.
Someone like Tony Smith will be able to explain this in more detail.

I think Henry came up with a great system. If you have a war time Jeep or a CMP or a 1972 Ford Escort, the root number for an engine block is 6xxx It is the prefix and suffix that change.

[Tony Smith]

Originally Posted by Lynn Eades

A Ford part number is usually made up of three parts:
Here is a basic run down.
The root number (eg 10130) refers to a generator pulley.
The prefix (eg 01AS) which denotes country and year of origin and particular vehicle application. (I have no reference material to decode the 01AS. This may mean the part is specific to the Lynx armoured car)
The last part is the suffix (in this case a "D")
The "D" denotes changes or improvements in that item and so you might have a pulley that to all intents is the same. however they may have added material to strengthen the design, improve the air flow from the fan, or maybe even dynamically balanced as opposed to a static balanced original (just trying to come up with examples) Each time a design improvement is introduced, the suffix changes.
Someone like Tony Smith will be able to explain this in more detail.

01A is the model code for a 1940 model standard Ford car. the "S" denotes a special part. To my eye, it may relate to the belt width, which looks in the pics to be wider than the regular "Wide belt". The Suffixes A, B, C, etc usually denote variable or interchangeable parts, in this case would be for pulley diameter.

Originally Posted by Tony Wheeler

"This led me to consult the parts list, whereupon I discovered there were in fact two different diameter pulleys fitted, nominally 3 1/2" and 4 1/2", the explanation for the smaller one being: "Use where low cut in speed is desired."

What this means is that the refers to the engine rpm when the Regulator Coil will close and provide charging current to the battery. A smaller pulley relative to the Crank pulley will turn the Genny shaft at higher rpm. The voltage output of the Genny will exceed Batt Voltage at a lower engine speed than with a larger Genny pulley. Generally, the larger pulleys were fitted to cars where engine speed would be quickly increased when driving, and usually sit at a higher cruise rpm. Light commercials and heavy trucks would be specified with progressively smaller pulleys, as these vehicles spend more of their duty cycle in lower rpm ranges.

In Ford Military Vehicles, the smaller pulleys were specified for vehicles that would spend time idling so that the Genny would spin fast enough to charge the Battery at high idle speeds. Typically Radio equipped vehicles, or those that made use of the PTO for a specific function.

I do have a list of the various sized pulley part numbers in both Single and Twin belt varieties.

[Tony Wheeler]

Originally Posted by Tony Smith

01A is the model code for a 1940 model standard Ford car. the "S" denotes a special part.

Very interesting Tony, and if you go back to Rick's original post where he gave his Lynx pulley dimensions you'll notice the front flange diameter is 2 3/4", whereas the pulley in my photo is 81 mm, which is closer to 3 1/4". Perhaps that's what the "S" relates to in the Lynx part number. Precisely what effect it has I don't know - I have other 4" pulleys (ie. 4" rear flange dia) with different front flange diameters again, but they all appear to fit the same belt width. Of course that's to the naked eye - you'd have to actually fit the belt and measure exactly how far out it sits to be sure. Perhaps there were slight variations to adjust rpm for particular applications, eg. the Lynx on 12V may have run a slightly smaller pulley diameter (ie. effective pulley diameter) to operate at slightly higher rpm. All speculation of course but the "S" would presumably indicate some kind of functional difference.

I'd like to see a photo of Rick's old pulley, and whether it has a part number on it. Of course there's no guarantee it's the original Lynx generator but it's quite likely to be.

[Tony Wheeler]

Originally Posted by Lynn Eades

The prefix (eg 01AS) which denotes country and year of origin and particular vehicle application.

Thanks Lynn, that might explain why some of my pulley part numbers don't appear in the parts list. For example 79-10130-C on one of my 4 1/2" twin belt CMP pulleys. The parts list only shows prefix 01W and C01W.

Good info on the Lucas genny too, I imagine much the same would hold true for the Ford genny as well. It's the same physics involved, all governed by Faraday's Law. The faster you spin a genny the more voltage it will generate, the only question being whether it's in a useful rpm range for the vehicle. The way my F15A revs on the highway with 16" wheels I suspect it could run a 24 volt system!

Changing the field coils interests me - from my limited knowledge it would only vary the current, not the voltage. I'm not quite sure why it's done, hopefully someone will educate me!

[Tony Wheeler]

Originally Posted by lynx42

there is a number on the back of the pulley but I am not sure if I can see it now as it is all back together.

It's FG 154 which doesn't help much! In fact I doubt we'll learn anything from part numbers, some of my pulleys have no part numbers at all. Some of my twin belt CMP pulleys have Ford part numbers that aren't even listed. And yet they're all identical, so why the different part number? There's a variety of cosmetic differences from different castings, but they're functionally identical and completely interchangeable.

Irrespective of part numbers and cosmetic differences though I'm certain the Lnyx pulley is just a standard 4" single belt Ford pulley, of which I have several. I'm certain the whole generator is standard Ford, the only question in my mind is voltage - did they rewind the armature or simply reset the voltage regulator? I wouldn't mind betting they used a standard 6V generator and simply reset the regulator. I'm pretty sure these gennys will pump out 12 volts at sufficiently low revs to make rewinding the armature unnecessary, particularly with the small pulley. I'd be interested to know the Lynx part number for the genny itself.

[lynx42]

Tony, the body and field windings are the same as the 6 volt genys. The difference is the commutator.

Lynx bits 062.jpg.

It has twice as many windings and segments. I took some photos to show the difference.

OOPs!! that's is the starter not the Genny. Anyway you can see the 12volt at the top and the 6volt below.

Looks like I forgot to photograph the Genny, so I don't know.

Regards Rick.

[Tony Wheeler]

Originally Posted by lynx42

It has twice as many windings and segments. I took some photos to show the difference.

Excellent comparison photo Rick, very interesting to see the difference. I don't think there are twice as many windings but there are certainly a lot more, presumably to produce the same torque at reduced current. I notice they're much heavier gauge on the 6V starter, presumably to operate at higher current. I'd be interested to hear the cranking speed with your 12V system, should be much the same the 6V system I imagine, which is good.

I had a quick look on a couple of hot rod sites and it turns out the 6V genny will definitely produce 12V satisfactorily, and some rodders only change the regulator. Others change the field coils in the genny as well, using 12V field coils out of later model cars. However I suspect that's more to protect them from higher voltage than anything else. Anyway it sounds like the armature is identical as I suspected, so the Lynx may simply use the standard 6V genny. Unless it has 12V stamped on it somewhere I think we can assume it's identical.

What all this means off course is there's no need to touch the genny when converting from 6V to 12V. Most people don't realize this and go to a lot of unnecessary trouble and expense.