T16 restoration starts in earnest

[andrew honychurch]

and one more!

[horsa]

In my opinion you'll be well past half way once you have it stripped and painted. Plus reassembly is coasting downhill compared to tearing it all down and then having to clean up or rebuild parts and assemblies.

[andrew honychurch]

I hope you are right, but I still have to attempt the rear axle, complete the engine build and set about the bogie assemblies! I am sure now that the hull is going to be away for a few weeks it will allow me to get along with those tasks. I am wondering whether not to go quite as far with the rear axle as you did. I intend on taking off the inspection covers on the brakebands and have a good look in. I will flush out the diff and see what comes out! Then rebuild both brakes either end. I hope it will save me a little bit of time not breaking the diff out. Any thoughts David?

[horsa]

Since yours was running with no issues from the differential, I'd say flush it out on the inside and repaint it on the outside. I had to tear mine down because it was a complete unknown. It was supposed to be NOS but having been stored by other people outside in the rain and mud for untold years, it was completely rusted over. I had no way to know if it was usable or not. And even if it were NOS, it could have still been rusted on the inside as well due to poor storage.

We're stuck with cold and damp conditions here at the moment as well. I have parts from two other smaller projects that are stripped and waiting to be painted. I'm priming some items when I can, one at a time on pieces of wire but its been slow. Spray outside under a covered porch and then carry them throught the house so I can hand them to very slowly dry in the garage which has really high humidity. Really my only option if I don't want them to start rusting again.

[Jordan Baker]

Andrew,

Your making good prgress. When I got into mine I first throught "oh geez, what I have done now" But then I just started doing one piece at a time. Sure it looks like nothing was being accomplished, but after a couple of months I'd have a pile of small stuff done. Then after 6 months or so I'd put the stuff all on and I'd amaze myself at what I had done. 7yrs later I think Im down to having enough fingers (thumbs included) on both hands to account for whats left to do or get(minus the tools).

And youve found one of the best communities for these vehicles anywhere in the world.

[andrew honychurch]

Thanks for the words of encouragement. Having restored a few MVs over the years when I was younger and had fewer other things going on in my life I am keen to get this done and finished rather than let it hang around in bits. The worst job in my view is the welding and fabrication of the missing or damaged tin work, largely because it falls outside of my area of capability and therefore I need to rely upon others, which is not only very frustrating if they drag their feet but also expensive. Pretty much everything else I can do for myself. I am also rather frustrated by the difficulty in getting parts for this. I realise we are now nearly 70 years after these carriers were produced but I have never had the problems getting parts for other vehicles as I am for this one! Back in the 90's there was a superb chap in the Uk called Chris Wilikinson who I am sad to say, as a very good friend of mine, has now departed this world. I used to get NOS items from him for my Stuart, Daimler Armoured Car, Half Track that we can only dream about today. Frustratingly he had a load of T16 parts most of which went into the smelting pot when he moved from his long time storage yard. Where have all the T16 parts gone?

[andrew honychurch]

Whilst the hull is away being repaired I have now started on the suspension units and wheels. With the help of David Gordon, who has provided me with much insight I have now stripped all the wheels of theire internal bearings and races in order to have them sandblasted and am just attempting to remove the suspension springs. The TM refers to a special spring compressor. Effectively it looks like a 6 inch tube with a bolt that fixes to the end of the spring centre shaft. Then I assume one turn a nut on the end of the tube and this draws the rod upwards compressing the spring in the process. Does anyone have one of these? Can anyone tell me or even better draw me a diagram of how it is constructed so that i can make one? The thread on the end of the spring centre shaft is 3/4 UNF for what its worth. Not sure whether this is the same on Universals as it is on my T16. As always any help much appreciated.

EDIT the coil spring compressors I have in place in the photo wont work as they dont compress the spring enough to get the bottom of the rod out of its housing, hence the need for the special tool, although the other TM refers to be able to use the track jack doing the same job, it occurs to me that the spring would be compressed only on one side with the track jack unless one could use two, and I dont think there will be enough clearance for that. As I dont, as yet have a track jack its slighly academic!

[SDT16]

I'll photograph the one I made. It worked really well. It is quite simple but you will need a small welder.

Stand By!

SD

[SDT16]

Ok, Here Ya Go!

Piece of pipe. About 12"
Threaded rod with 2 nuts. Must be longer than the pipe.
Large washer
1 nut with threads matching Suspension Rod. You will have to round the outside down to enable it to slide inside the pipe.

Weld rounded nut to one end of rod. Install washer and adjusting nut onto rod. Weld another nut on opposite end. The tube will slide over rounded nut end.

Keep in mind to make your lengths of the pipe and the threaded rod long enough to enable enough compression, as well as, enough room to release all spring tension once it is out of its socket.

Also!!!... When you are releasing the spring tension. Be sure you have a wrench on the rod so that you do not prematurely unscrew the tool from the suspension rod!!!!! And always KEEP Clear of both ends incase your welds break!!! I'm sure those springs could send things Flying!!!

Hope this Helps!

[andrew honychurch]

Fantastic. thats really helpful and I am most grateful. I have been thinking about this today, and that exactly the design I came up with . ( I would say that wouldnt i?)

I managed to pick up a track jack today and it is not safe for the job. Basically the fingers dont grip well enough and the jaws can swivel so it constantly twists. You are quite correct that the spring tension is enormous and I think you could brain yourself or take a finger off in a sprice.

I need to go get some pip, I recokon on 1 5/8 O/D which will sit in the recess where the nut normally sits and sit nice and square. Then I can wind the spring up to my hearts content. Thats the job for the weekend.

What i also reckoned was that it one thing getting these springs off but getting them back on will be pretty tricky so having a nice square pull with this puller will make the job safer and easier.

I really appreciate your help

thx Andrew

[andrew honychurch]

I had quite a good day today, and managed to find a full set of tools for the T16 and one or two other bits and bobs. Quite made my day to be honest

[SDT16]

No Problem Andrew!
It worked really well for us.
Here is the thread I started for mine.
http://www.mapleleafup.org/forums/sh...ad.php?t=13958

Unfortunately we have not made a lot of progress recently as I am Restoring a Sexton for a friend.

There is one part I still need if you should come across one. It is the oil bypass valve assembly. It mounts on the left rear of the bell housing.
Here is a pic.

Good Luck!

SD

[andrew honychurch]

Hi Sean, of course I will look out for the valve for you. I will ask around a bit as well. You never know. Yours looks great, a very nice hull. Was it in the US for all its life or is it a Swiss Import?

I was going to ask you as well..did you high tensile stell thread for the compressor? I was wondering whether ordinary soft threaded bar will hold up to the pressure?

[SDT16]

That is just regular old steel stock. The nuts may have been a higher grade but I can't remember. Might be best to use a grade 8 nut for attaching to the suspension rod. When you screw the tool to the Suspension Rod, be sure you get it all the way on.

Our T-16 came out of Europe via a museum here in the states. It was not a swiss carrier to the best of my knowledge. It was "restored" (HA!) before it came over here. But it did not have the correct engine, overheated a lot etc....

It was partly disassembled when we purchased it 15 yrs ago...... Just now getting to it.

[andrew honychurch]

ok, well I have now purchased all the items to make my puller. Sounds like a cookery recipe! I will attempt to weld it all together tommorrow but am expected to be on family duty so may not get the time I need to concentrate on it. I made one slip up, in that I bought some big washers for the top of the tube but as my Dad pointed out a washer will bend! So I need to cut a plate for the top of the tube and perhaps even weld it to the top. We will see.. More tommorrow hopefully with all limls intact!

[Lynn Eades]

The original tool has a hook on it to help locate the tool some how.
The whole purpose of it is to draw the rod back far enough at one end, so that the other end of the rod is clear of the hole. When you have them apart, be careful of the "cup" It is like brake lining material,which acts as a bearing on the ball. I suggest that you carefully wire a ball into each of these, when sending the suspension to the blasters, or the blasting will rip them to bits.
I have included a picture from the Aust. carrier book. and the text to explain its use. Apart from the thread types, it is the same for all the carriers.
It might be worth making a good job of the tool, as it is used to replace springs, and someone will want to borrow it later.

[motto]

That hook as you call it Lynn appears to be an anti rotation lug.
David

[Lynn Eades]

Thats right.trying to get the point accross that there was something extra to it. I wrote most of the post, and then couldnt find the picture. I then had to take the picture, and down load it etc.
Just trying to help.
David I see you can mis name things as well (Lloyd)

[andrew honychurch]

thanks Guys. Thats very useful picture. Thats a job my my father who loves doing this sort of thing on the lathe.

[andrew honychurch]

Got up early this morning and welded the spring compressor together. Its perfect, it is simply not worth attempting without one of these and really so easy to make. Thanks for the help guys.

Lynn what do you think the cups with in the spring locaters are made of? On the T16 they are riveted in and look like they are steel or brass or something like that. Someone told me they are leather but they dont look like it. I am going to clean these suspension units by hand as I dont want to take out all the bushes which would be destroyed by sand blasting so no need to distrub the cups anyway.

[motto]

A 'senior moment' Lynn. I had just been dealing with a fellow named Lloyd elsewhere. It was only there for a few minutes and I hoped no one would notice.
I wasn't having a go at you by the way. Just trying to be helpful.
David

[RichardT10829]

Andrew i have seen the cups made from an asbestos composite....so be careful dude

[andrew honychurch]

I will take care thanks Richard. Is there a consensus on whether the ball (male) should be painted or bare metal with grease applied?

[Lynn Eades]

Definately bare metal, and no lube. Paint what you see, up to the ball part.
To sand blast the housings, a large bolt (threaded rod) and some big washers to go against the end of the bushes will do the job.

David, I only knew you'd called me Lloyd, because the system sends me an email, of your original post. I've been called a lot worse in the past.

[andrew honychurch]

On the plus side I have cleaned and painted the first suspension unit, on the minus I have discovered one of the internal rear suspension springs has broken. On the T16 the rear bogie has smaller springs inside the standard springs and it is one of these that has snapped. I guess my chance of getting one of these is pretty slim, unless anyone can help me, is it possible to weld springs? I sort of assume its an impossibilty and it may well break again. Thoughts please? thx Andrew

[RichardT10829]

Andrew, you can weld springs but the problem is they will snap either side of where you heated the steel to weld it. i reckon you could get some made if the fabricator has something as a pattern. seems to be a popular issue i have heard of a fair few folks springs being snapped. I hope you get it sortid good luck

[andrew honychurch]

yes, i have been googling and it seems a bit of a waste of time to try to weld them. I will measure it up tommorrow and see if I can find anyone who has one or can make one at a half sensible price. thx

[Ron Pier]

Google ALBERTA SPRINGS ask for Graham. They have made me several motorcycle fork springs from patterns, and can adjust the finished length to your specification to allow for wear in the original pattern. I highly recommend them. For price comparison, a single fork spring in say .007" wire is about £35 but cheaper for small batches. Ron

[andrew honychurch]

Hey Ron, thanks for that its very useful. as I live in the UK I am goign to try to source something here for obvious reasons, but will make a not of Alberta and revert to them if needs be. Thanks once again. Andrew

[Ron Pier]

Just to be clear Andrew. I am also in the UK (Poole)....not a million miles from you. Despite their name Alberta springs are in Colchester.....again not a million miles away. Ron