Odiham ww2 vehicle pics

[ted angus]

Thanks for sharing Noel, possibly the hats are for identification purposes possibly a pre hostilities war game ?? Normally these trailers would be shoehorned into a hedgerow etc the civvy car appears to have unmasked headlights ??

regards TED

[Larry Hayward]

Ted I understand what you are saying regarding the records but from what you have found so far, when do you think RAF blue was overpainted on 'frontline' RAF vehicles in the UK during WW2; Sept 1939 or post Dunkirk?

[ted angus]

From the photo evidence, units issued with warning orders for service with the Air Component Field Force would possibly have commenced camo painting late july /early August 1939, whilst most of the warned units embarked for France some didn't. General Alert was called about a week before the famous speech. From what I have read in Operational Order Books, Station and Sqn war books contained lists of measures to be initiated as the alert state went up. I would think camo painting would have been one along with aircraft dispersal, sandbagging, opening and equiping shelters etc etc. So my best guess is it commenced on non Field Force units in the weeks or week prior to declaring war.
Larry you use the word "Frontline"; as far as the RAF in UK was concerned it is difficult to quantify frontline; we could say Biggin Hill North Weald etc etc. most publications say the south east of England was the frontline, but this is something else I don't fully subscribe to. Turnhouse and Drem were the first frontline units as German based ac attacked their sectors in a bid to hit Rosyth and of course the protecting aerodromes. In addition the RAF crane on a 42 Group Maintenance Command Maintenance Unit loading bombs, oxygen cylinders and fuel into railway waggons for delivery to the operational aerodromes was to me as big a target as many airfields and therefore equally frontline in the context we are mulling over. . Even the barrage balloon winch trucks seem to have received a lick of camo very early on. I wish I could spend a month at Kew and Hendon and with the air historical branch; when the answers are found I don't think it will be a "tell all" document but it will be a one sentence comment in something like a Station or Sqn operations log that will reveal some key parts of the jigsaw.
Regards
TED

[Noel Burgess]

Ted (and anyone else who might be interested) I think I've found a date and description for the second trailer photo I posted...
"Photo developer or maybe flight office at Hornchurch 1940, 25 Sqn Blenhiem Mk1"

Noel

[ted angus]

Hi Noel its a real head scratcher been looking at 25 sqn history, Hornchurch was never one of their bases so they were either using it as a satalite or forward base etc.
on the right is a guy carrying what looks like an over coat, yet the 2 mystery men have daft hats. no blackout masks on the cars, no attempt to hide the trailer no criss cross tape on the windows, ?? turning to the 2 strange men they have a uniform of overalls with a pocket at each breast, these pockets have silver buttons, the ankle of the trouser is gathered in but they only appear to have shoes on. on each of THIER right breasts just below the pocket is an emblem or badge ?/

Some of Charles Brown's work is published in a series of books Cameras above the clouds 4 volumes selling for big bucks may be the picture is in there.
regards
TED

[ted angus]

Noel just had a look at the Artique gallery website Charles Brown album there is a piccy of a MK1 Blenhiem being refuelled . Again Hornchurch the bowser is in plain colour open headlights but has the same lumps of grass as the trailer. the tile say Hornchurch 1939; so my money stays on a Home Defence exercise pre hostilities 1939

TED

[ted angus]

Originally Posted by Noel Burgess

Ted (and anyone else who might be interested) I think I've found a date and description for the second trailer photo I posted...
"Photo developer or maybe flight office at Hornchurch 1940, 25 Sqn Blenhiem Mk1"

Noel

Noel have been comparing with my photo tender pictures I think all the trailers with the window at the front and the extractor fan are flight offices,
the photo vans and trailers of a very similar design didn't have the window at the front, what's your thoughts chaps
TED

[Noel Burgess]

Just a quick thought on the "sun hat" men in the picture I posted - they, and the sitting figure who is writing/drawing, appear to have white shirts as well as the points about there clothes which Ted noticed. Could it be possible that they are visiting "boffins" an that the white hats are to make them stand out for safety reasons??
Noel

[ted angus]

Noel I showed one of my sons the picture he is also heavily into RAF history; I think we are all singing from the same sheet boffins; observers, or similar. Their jackets/trousers/coveralls do not conform to anything that is obviously RAF.
I found an RAF Data book sheet that describes the Office trailers mounted on Brockhouse and Eagle chassis and the split opening front window and extractor vent cowl fit perfectly; I will endeavour to get the rest of pages that make up the sheet , which should give a picture.
TED